Engine build idea

[Oltorf]

This is kind of a "shower thoughts" kind of idea. I'm not seriously considering doing it, but it's fun to think about. I know a lot of people will say "just do an LS" or "it's not worth it." Thanks, but that's not much fun.

So I wanted FI of some kind in my 4.8iS. No one makes a kit, but new N63 engines have a pretty rad hot-V twin turbo set-up - but that would mean using a smaller engine. I wonder if the heads and up from a N63 engine could be swapped into the 4.8L. Stroke is the same, bore is a bit bigger on the 4.8. Rods from the N63 could be used and I'd have to find some forged piston heads that would give the same compression ratio.

I don't know how much different the blocks are. I'm hoping they're mostly the same, otherwise this engine build would be pointless.

There are a bunch of other things to consider - exhaust routing, transmission and transfer case, etc, but this is all I was worried about so far.

Twin turbo factory setup 4.8 would be pretty pretty pretty pretty cool.

[scourtaud23]

You don't necessarily need to go the hot V route, with relatively small turbo and one hell of a manifold planning, you should be able to fit twin turbos and keep the existing block and heads.



This would however require cams to be ground (expensive but easy enough if you can calculate a good profile) and mapping would be quite the job. It might be interesting to lock out the vanos either by mapping or mechanically (a good weld would do but require balancing afterwards).

Depending on your target output, you might need stronger valves (again, expensive but easy) and forged pistons, maybe modified to lower the compression ratio to allow for better use of the turbo. Getting crazy, stronger rods (balanced and maybe lighter), then you can go for a stronger crankshaft but that seems excessive considering you're on an auto gearbox, unless you plan on drag racing daily, you probably won't flex the crank.


It would be quite an undertaking but you could have a monster on your hands. Ideally your best friend should be a machinist with talent and equipment since all these parts could be machined "at home" with the proper tools and materials.


I've wondered about adding one or two turbos to my 4.6 but it would be too much work and I'm not sure what I would do with the extra power in such a car.

[wpoll]

Reminds me of when I discovered that 4.4l V8 Diesel from the TDV8 Range Rover would quite likely drop right into the e53 chassis. The engine mounts and driveline look like they would line up, including the front drive shaft and diff, which appears to be the same arrangement as BMW use (thought the sump!).

Evil thoughts...!!

[scourtaud23]

Originally Posted by wpoll

Reminds me of when I discovered that 4.4l V8 Diesel from the TDV8 Range Rover would quite likely drop right into the e53 chassis. The engine mounts and driveline look like they would line up, including the front drive shaft and diff, which appears to be the same arrangement as BMW use (thought the sump!).

Evil thoughts...!!

Going down this route, I've looked at crashed supercharged 322 Ranger rovers more than once... Specially the first series with 420bhp that sits in place of an M62... Even the 510 bhp fits in the same space that was designed for a 322... This is the dark side...

[Oltorf]

Originally Posted by wpoll

Reminds me of when I discovered that 4.4l V8 Diesel from the TDV8 Range Rover would quite likely drop right into the e53 chassis. The engine mounts and driveline look like they would line up, including the front drive shaft and diff, which appears to be the same arrangement as BMW use (thought the sump!).

Evil thoughts...!!

That's funny, I always wanted to swap a BMW I6 into a Discovery. someone on pirate 4x4 started that same project but I haven't kept up with it.

[Oltorf]

Originally Posted by scourtaud23

You don't necessarily need to go the hot V route, with relatively small turbo and one hell of a manifold planning, you should be able to fit twin turbos and keep the existing block and heads.



This would however require cams to be ground (expensive but easy enough if you can calculate a good profile) and mapping would be quite the job. It might be interesting to lock out the vanos either by mapping or mechanically (a good weld would do but require balancing afterwards).

Depending on your target output, you might need stronger valves (again, expensive but easy) and forged pistons, maybe modified to lower the compression ratio to allow for better use of the turbo. Getting crazy, stronger rods (balanced and maybe lighter), then you can go for a stronger crankshaft but that seems excessive considering you're on an auto gearbox, unless you plan on drag racing daily, you probably won't flex the crank.


It would be quite an undertaking but you could have a monster on your hands. Ideally your best friend should be a machinist with talent and equipment since all these parts could be machined "at home" with the proper tools and materials.


I've wondered about adding one or two turbos to my 4.6 but it would be too much work and I'm not sure what I would do with the extra power in such a car.

that's not a bad idea, but i imagine BMW engineers know a lot more than I do. Plus i'd use the newer trans and transfer case.

[wpoll]

Originally Posted by Oltorf

That's funny, I always wanted to swap a BMW I6 into a Discovery. someone on pirate 4x4 started that same project but I haven't kept up with it.

Now THAT would be sensible... but I don't think this thread is about sensible!

[wpoll]

Here's the (Ford-built) 4.4 litre TDV8 I referred to above - you can even see the diff mount points and the tunnel for the right-side drive shaft on the sump..




And like your proposed twin-turbo N62, engine management would be the hardest hurdle...

[scourtaud23]

I6 in a discovery has already happened a few times, I don't know what is the right combination but there is one that almost bolts in place in some version of the discovery.

As for swapping the x5, any DME is going to be a pain to get the car working with no codes. Technically anything can be coded and an interface between the new DME and the other existing modules could be created but the time and cost is going to hurt for objectively a small power gain.

There might be an easy solution trying to extract more power from the existing engine, I'm quite sure if you give up on fuel economy and some durability, you could extract more power and torque as you wouldn't be trying to make an engine durable in every climate on most fuels and with the best fuel economy possible.

If the goal is performance, the solution might be looking into a more efficient gearbox with better gearing for your use, no one needs an suv that can go above 120 mph these days and the gearbox would be way easier to interface to the car. Adding an switch front disconnect could be interesting also but that's another game.

[Oltorf]

I talked to someone at BPC and they said the blocks are too different for it to work. oh well.