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  #1  
Old 02-08-2022, 03:15 PM
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Silver project adjustable camber toe kit and air suspension issue

So I reinstalled my factory two axle air suspension with all new parts on my 4.8 IS. New front and rear air springs new struts and coded and calibrated everything to stock height.

That also installed a 20 piece lemforder front and rear suspension kit which included brand new rear toe and camber arms

Then I proceeded to use INPA to lower the air suspension by about 38 mm which is about 1.5 in and it looked great.

When I went to get an alignment The best they could do on the rear alignment lowered 1.5 in was about -2.8 of camber with the toe set to 0.00

I proceeded to purchase the silver project adjustable kit for the rear and installed them.

Went back to the alignment shop. We set the rear camber to super tire saving mode which was -1 camber and zero toe

Everything was fine until I went to lower My air suspension system and only the front would lower and not the rear. Then the complete air suspension got into this weird state where all four corners were confused and sitting at different heights because the rear would not sit.

I tried diagnosing and debugging so many things only to find out when I put the X5 in the air that the rear airbags were physically touching the inner fender wells like bad.

I said well that's not good. So I deflated the bags and readjusted the camber and toe arms manually Just by eye until I saw that the rear airbags were no longer interfering and had about a quarter of an inch clearance between the inner fender well and the bag itself.

Then I spent about 2 days using INPA to go through a combination of resetting the ehc2 module back to defaults flashing with the default software from NCS expert based on my VO settings in the vehicle to make sure I software was flashed with sport ride height settings and then lowering and measuring each corner repeatedly and driving to settle and remeasuring etc...such a PITA

Then I went back to the alignment shop threw it in the air. Talked to the alignment guy. We both looked at everything while he adjusted and we tackled adjusting the rear camber and toe as much as we could without the airbags touching the inner fender wells.

In the end, the best we could get with the X5 lowered 1.5 in and the silver project arms installed. We got a rear negative camber of -2.1 and the toe set to toe out .16.

This actually ended up being within factory specifications, so I guess that's a good thing that I can actually be lowered 1.5 in and be adjusted camber and toe wise to factory spec the airbags have about an eighth of an inch clearance between themselves and the rear inner fender well.

Still don't have a great feeling about that and I have not seen anybody document this. Maybe people don't even look at the airbag clearance when they get their alignment adjusted. I don't know, but it's definitely a weird situation.

I was curious if anybody else had ever seen anything like this before and maybe it just one of those things where because of the way the silver project arms adjust camber and tow. They pull the control arms out from the top compared to the factory camber adjustments which adjusts from the bottom and when you adjust from the top with the new arms it brings the airbag much closer to The inner fender wells


I have pictures to document it.

Curious what people's thoughts are on this.


The first picture shows the airbag touching and that's with the camber set to -1 and toe set to zero

The second picture shows what the airbag looks like and about a quarter of an inch clearance from the inner fender well now with rear camber now set to -2.1 and 0.16 toe.

And the third picture is what my current alignment specs are.

Since the airbags are brand new, I'm not really as concerned about them Ballooning and touching the inner fender well but over time when these things stretch with age I could definitely see it becoming a problem and I may have to remove the airbags and take a grinding wheel and grind away some of the undercoating that is protruding out and then spray it with rust inhibitor just to gain maybe a 16th of an inch clearance more.

Also, the factory camber bolts on the bottom of the control arm are set at max positive camber so there is no more adjustment on that. Adjusting it back to negative would only further the problem.

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  #2  
Old 02-08-2022, 03:30 PM
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I imagine that there could be differences in OD of different manufacturers air bags?? Is it possible that the bags are offset and not installed properly?
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Old 02-08-2022, 03:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 80stech View Post
I imagine that there could be differences in OD of different manufacturers air bags?? Is it possible that the bags are offset and not installed properly?
i thought that but remembered that the Bags get installed one way. left side only fits on left side and same for the right side. each bag on the bottom is keyed to fit into the control ar for the spring clip and on top it has a guide pin that is clocked specifically for its side each bag has a different PN for left and right side as well which i confirmed.

these are ARNOTT Sport bags from FCP euro if that makes a difference

i know people on here have said you need Comfort bags for 4.8s with sport suspension VO but then someone else posted an email they received from an engineer at Arnott that stated the bags were identical in size and sport vs comfort had nothing to do with size width/height and the only different was in spring rate for comfort vs sport.

makes me wonder how many people with air suspension that installed adjustable camber and toe arms even looked at how close their bags were to the inner fender well. im sure people dont even look at that and most people probably just used the adjustable arms so that they could lower their X5 and then be able to align the rear to stock OE specs of -2.1 and in my case i tried to go beyond that and it was just not going to work.
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Old 02-08-2022, 06:50 PM
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Are the bags touching the inner fender when the vehicle is on the ground or the air? I don't have the adjustable cumber kit, but I didn't pay attention to the bags fender proximity when I replaced the rear ones. I'd be worried if they were that close. I'll check this weekend. Thanks for bringing to light that little detail.
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Last edited by X5only; 02-08-2022 at 06:58 PM.
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Old 02-08-2022, 07:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X5only View Post
Are the bags touching the inner fender when the vehicle is on the ground or the air? I don't have the adjustable cumber kit, but I didn't pay attention to the bags fender proximity when I replaced the rear ones. I'd be worried if they were that close. I'll check this weekend. Thanks for bringing to light that little detail.
Both of pictures showing the bag clearance to inner fender well are taken with x5 on the ground with suspension loaded.

Before on -1 camber 0 toe, air bag was touching
After with -2.1 Camber and .16 toe, air bag has about 1/8 clearance from fender well and no longer touching but it's close.

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Last edited by nextelbuddy; 02-08-2022 at 09:14 PM.
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Old 09-15-2022, 02:23 PM
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I bought a Silver Project Camber kit comprising camber and toe arms. They were only on a fortnight and one of the camber arms collapsed. I am now looking for a replacement to get rid of negative camber. Any suggestions other than Thayer Motorsports gladly received. Cheers.
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Old 09-15-2022, 02:39 PM
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Did you also renew the rose bushes on the rear suspension?
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Old 09-15-2022, 02:49 PM
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Hello, yes everything was replaced on the rear apart from the sub frame bushes as they were not at all worn.
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Old 09-15-2022, 03:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duvet1 View Post
I bought a Silver Project Camber kit comprising camber and toe arms. They were only on a fortnight and one of the camber arms collapsed. I am now looking for a replacement to get rid of negative camber. Any suggestions other than Thayer Motorsports gladly received. Cheers.
Do you have any pics of the broken arm? Have you contacted the manufacturer?
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Old 09-15-2022, 04:05 PM
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Yes, I have some photo's. The bent arm one was sent to me today by the mechanic who has my car and yes I shall email the manufacturer but I do not think I will be successful as they could question many things and deny responsibility.Name:  IMG-20220915-WA0000_copy_960x1280.jpg
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