A rant!!

[Weasel]

AMEN. I see the best and the worst come in at the dealer. In the same week I'll have an 01 with 220k+ miles come in for an oil change that looks and runs like a brand new vehicle, then have an 05 with ~65k miles come in that's already so trashed out that I could vomit! Body trashed with dents/dings/scratches, wheels bent and curb rashed to the max, el cheapo tires worn to the chords.... and the tan interior turning black with soo much trash in the back you can't get th the spare.

Your vehicle is only as good as you make it/keep it!

[skiboats]

Originally Posted by weasel56

AMEN. I see the best and the worst come in at the dealer. In the same week I'll have an 01 with 220k+ miles come in for an oil change that looks and runs like a brand new vehicle

Your vehicle is only as good as you make it/keep it!

I like that part of the story!

[Bimmer Ese]

Well said my friend. I know my cars aren't perfect, but I sure love to work on them. I've worked on other cars before, such as GM's (Corvettes...I will never touch a C4 Corvette again , POS Oldsmobiles), Lincolns and Nissans. BMW's are so much easier to work on.

When it comes to maintenance, I'm always on top of my vehicles. I too, agree with Weasel56 about nice cars with 200k+ miles and those ruff 75k mile cars. Pretty sad how some people treat their cars.

Daniel

[RichiRich]

Mac,

Very well said! Funny, my neighbors think that I am sick because I am always washing, waxing and cleaning my car....or have the hood up doing a diy oil change.....etc. etc.. When I visit my INDY - I always have him look at any preventitive type fixes before the volcano blows....then i'll have my other Indy do the same. Kinda like asking a different DR. for a second opinion. Best of all We/I have X5world for preventative maint. and answers to quick questions. Just the other day weasel56 helped me with an issue that 2 days later is resolved......I'm @ 90k.....with an 02'..........knock on my thick skull things are going very well..

R Rich

[StanF18]

Agreed with all.

But just to play Devil's advocate and make it interesting, how then to explain the Hondas and Toyotas that "take a lickin' and keep on tickin'"??
I'm not even talking about the well-maintained ones. I'm talking about multiple missed oil changes, 250,000 miles on the odometer, and clueless owners, and yet time and again: THEY are the ones enjoying their brand's reputation for durability and reliability, while us Bavario-philes keep running to our indies and dealers for stupid sh#$. Headlight condensation, hatch rattling, CV joints, water pump, A/C blower, squeaks, rattles, leaks, and so on and so forth. Most of the Honda owners don't even know who their service rep is, while we are ALL intimately acquainted with ours. As much as I love my X, I wouldn't fault anyone for "bitching and moaning" about their X. BMW needs to aspire to both the ultimate driving experience AND the ultimate reliability experience. I do not see why they cannot institute more stringent quality control on their assembly lines, especially after certain issues are identified as problem areas on specific models.

[BGM]

Originally Posted by StanF18

Agreed with all.

But just to play Devil's advocate and make it interesting, how then to explain the Hondas and Toyotas that "take a lickin' and keep on tickin'"??
I'm not even talking about the well-maintained ones. I'm talking about multiple missed oil changes, 250,000 miles on the odometer, and clueless owners, and yet time and again: THEY are the ones enjoying their brand's reputation for durability and reliability, while us Bavario-philes keep running to our indies and dealers for stupid sh#$. Headlight condensation, hatch rattling, CV joints, water pump, A/C blower, squeaks, rattles, leaks, and so on and so forth. Most of the Honda owners don't even know who their service rep is, while we are ALL intimately acquainted with ours. As much as I love my X, I wouldn't fault anyone for "bitching and moaning" about their X. BMW needs to aspire to both the ultimate driving experience AND the ultimate reliability experience. I do not see why they cannot institute more stringent quality control on their assembly lines, especially after certain issues are identified as problem areas on specific models.

Well to play devil's advocate to you playing devil's advocate: Honda and Toyota are not in the same market as BMW. Yes they are reliable but the performance, engineering and tech stuff is not as complex as on a BMW. I guess a better comparison would be to use MB, etc. But I agree and can contest as an almost 8 year owner that you take care of your car and it will take care of you. There are the extreme cases where mechanical meltdowns occur on some owners as bad luck but on the most part I think most are happy with theirs.

[The Cleaner]

Originally Posted by StanF18

Agreed with all.

But just to play Devil's advocate and make it interesting, how then to explain the Hondas and Toyotas that "take a lickin' and keep on tickin'"??
I'm not even talking about the well-maintained ones. I'm talking about multiple missed oil changes, 250,000 miles on the odometer, and clueless owners, and yet time and again: THEY are the ones enjoying their brand's reputation for durability and reliability, while us Bavario-philes keep running to our indies and dealers for stupid sh#$. Headlight condensation, hatch rattling, CV joints, water pump, A/C blower, squeaks, rattles, leaks, and so on and so forth. Most of the Honda owners don't even know who their service rep is, while we are ALL intimately acquainted with ours. As much as I love my X, I wouldn't fault anyone for "bitching and moaning" about their X. BMW needs to aspire to both the ultimate driving experience AND the ultimate reliability experience. I do not see why they cannot institute more stringent quality control on their assembly lines, especially after certain issues are identified as problem areas on specific models.

I'll play devils advocate advocate . Japanese cars Perform to a different standard, for example most are front wheel drive (less expensive to produce) they also use parts designed to deliver dependability/reliability over driving experience. Thats because to improve the driver experience you will have to make some design compromises to optimum reliability. Toyotas drive terrible, they have harsh suspensions average brakes and average material quality on the interior. Honda does a little better but they have higher repair cost and the automatic transmission will fail by 100k on many Accords.

A Subaru WRX is a great car but is noisy and rides like a truck. The toyota highlander feels light and cheap. Those are the only cars I have personal experience with but the point is to get to the ultimate driving experience you need to look past the ultimate reliability experience. A SATISFIED BMW owner like myself who has owned at least 10 BMW's is not buying the ultimate reliability machine, I am buying the ultimate driving machine and will accept the need for regular upkeep to maintain it. If I need the ultimate reliability machine I'll look for a manual Toyota corolla or Honda civic.

[Bimmer Ese]

From what I've seen (and dealt) with Japanese vehicles, the batteries do not last, shocks/struts leak/wear prematurely, weatherstripping tears easily and brake pads last around 30K.

Just my .02 pesos

[realchef]

Originally Posted by StanF18

Agreed with all.

But just to play Devil's advocate and make it interesting, how then to explain the Hondas and Toyotas that "take a lickin' and keep on tickin'"??
I'm not even talking about the well-maintained ones. I'm talking about multiple missed oil changes, 250,000 miles on the odometer, and clueless owners, and yet time and again: THEY are the ones enjoying their brand's reputation for durability and reliability, while us Bavario-philes keep running to our indies and dealers for stupid sh#$. Headlight condensation, hatch rattling, CV joints, water pump, A/C blower, squeaks, rattles, leaks, and so on and so forth. Most of the Honda owners don't even know who their service rep is, while we are ALL intimately acquainted with ours. As much as I love my X, I wouldn't fault anyone for "bitching and moaning" about their X. BMW needs to aspire to both the ultimate driving experience AND the ultimate reliability experience. I do not see why they cannot institute more stringent quality control on their assembly lines, especially after certain issues are identified as problem areas on specific models.

I have friends with a couple of these eternal cars, Volvo, Toyota and a Honda. Here's the rub. When you get next to them or drive them there are always things they neglect but ride 'em out. And the ride, one feels liek a death trap, "but it has 200k and I don't do anything." Well, IMHO it shows on those cars. I have never personally seen a high mileage Japanese car that wasn't clearly showing it's age.

I have an 01 with 45k and any non Bimmer person swears it's 2 years old or recently new. (they do not know the tell-tale minutia you guys do) I think this is where the difference lies, it's the cost of maintaining it to a higher standard. Besides the fact that we are talking apples and oranges engineering wise. I would like to see one of those other cars cover the speeds, corners and distance of a BMW as regularly, if at all.

Mechanical systems break, regardless. You bought a higher dollar car and you should expect to pay a higher dollar on the maintenance.