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  #1  
Old 09-26-2018, 08:48 PM
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clearing transmission adaptations after fluid change?

I recently had a shop do a drain and fill with an generic ATF which meets the M-1375.4 Shell Spec thankfully . Initially, they said BMW fluid and realized they only had Total bulk on hand. Argghhh!! That being said, ZF nomenclature states to reset the " adaptations" and do a " teach in" procedure.

Ironically, I spoke to a ZF approved shop. Apparently 1-15 in the whole U.S. and the tech strongly recommended against doing so. " It may never relearn 100%". He sounded like very adamant in his stance. So I dropped the subject.

Do you guys think he is correct in saying that vs what ZF service nomenclature says? I know once the transmission module learns, basically the clutch packs engage at different points and solenoids engage at different values.

The issue i'm having is that it seems to hold gear a bit before upshifting or downshifting. ( not always) When its cold it seems to be a better, hot it seems to hold a bit longer. The issue was present before the fluid change also. I'm wondering if the mechatronic sleeves are causing this? The tech recommended a transmission reprogramming from BMW which he claims would fix alot of this assuming its the original map from the factory.

I have a 08 X5 with the 3.0 N52 55k miles.

Last edited by EMT760RR; 09-26-2018 at 08:59 PM.
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  #2  
Old 09-26-2018, 11:37 PM
ard ard is offline
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You should not have mixed the BMW fluid that was left in the trans with the total fluid...the ONLY fluid that is speciifed by BMW is ZF. Period.

Meeting m1375.4 is not a full and adequate spec. In other words, they lied to you about having BMW fluid, then lied to you that the shell spec is adeaute.

You should reset the adaptations. This is what ZF says. I dont trust 'a guy' at a 'zf approved shop'

(WTF is a 'ZF approved' shop anyway????????? Where can we see this listing?)

The 'tech' recommnened a BMW reprogramming?!? lol. What is he even saying?

Basically they said they can do the fluid, then they did a crap job, wrong fluid and didnt reset adaptations...now they are doing (saying) whatver they can to get you out of their life.
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  #3  
Old 09-26-2018, 11:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ard View Post
You should not have mixed the BMW fluid that was left in the trans with the total fluid...the ONLY fluid that is speciifed by BMW is ZF. Period.

Meeting m1375.4 is not a full and adequate spec. In other words, they lied to you about having BMW fluid, then lied to you that the shell spec is adeaute.

You should reset the adaptations. This is what ZF says. I dont trust 'a guy' at a 'zf approved shop'

(WTF is a 'ZF approved' shop anyway????????? Where can we see this listing?)

The 'tech' recommnened a BMW reprogramming?!? lol. What is he even saying?

Basically they said they can do the fluid, then they did a crap job, wrong fluid and didnt reset adaptations...now they are doing (saying) whatver they can to get you out of their life.
The shop that did the " drain and fill" was different than the shop that supposedly is " certified" by ZF. If you goto their website and see their youtube ads they claim they're one of 1-15 in the U.S. that is approved by ZF. But recommended programming it with a new software update. Not resetting adaptations.

This Fluidmatic claims to meet ZF M-1375.4 Shell Specs. But you're saying this alone doesn't pass muster? link https://catalog.lubricants.total.com...UIDMATIC-MV-LV

What are the chances of just flushing out the transmission and starting over again? I recently took a trip that total'd a few thousand miles up to Canada from CA. The vehicle has 55k on it. Does the transmission stand a chance of being saved?
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Old 09-27-2018, 09:55 AM
ard ard is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EMT760RR View Post
The shop that did the " drain and fill" was different than the shop that supposedly is " certified" by ZF. If you goto their website and see their youtube ads they claim they're one of 1-15 in the U.S. that is approved by ZF. But recommended programming it with a new software update. Not resetting adaptations.

This Fluidmatic claims to meet ZF M-1375.4 Shell Specs. But you're saying this alone doesn't pass muster? link https://catalog.lubricants.total.com...UIDMATIC-MV-LV

What are the chances of just flushing out the transmission and starting over again? I recently took a trip that total'd a few thousand miles up to Canada from CA. The vehicle has 55k on it. Does the transmission stand a chance of being saved?
1. I understand it was two different shops. I understnad the second was the "ZF certified" shop. Telling me that it was a self-promotional claim about being only one of 15 in the USA helps. Discount this 100% unless you can verify with ZF.

2. BMW doesn't pump out software updates for the transmission left and right. If your car has the 'proper' SW in it, and it is likely it has, there is no update. Anyone -including BMW- can press the 'reset adapttations' button. There are perhaps 100 posts here and on Bimmerfest of people that have reset adaptations an it has (1) worked and (2) not had a negative impact. Hence this 'one of 16 ZF certtified shops' advic3e to not reset adaptations seems like stunningly bad advice.

3. ZF recommends only ZF fluid. Period. BMW recommends only ZF fluid. The fact that ZF fluid meets 1575 and 'other fluid' means 1575 DOES NOT MEAN that ZF='other fluid'. Remember those Venn Diagrams? Classic example.

4. To be frank, I would not be concerned about your mixed fluids. If you are having ANY shifting issues, don't worry about fluid. The fix is probably a 2x drain and fill, which will get 75-80% out (math subject to correction). But again, why piss away $$$ if you are still chasing issues.

5. Why didn't you (they) do the mechatronics sleeve when they dropped the pan and changed the filter?!?

GL
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Old 09-27-2018, 04:30 PM
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If the shop was Dose BMW in El Cajon, their claims are accurate. Up until a dozen or so years ago they were the only ZF certified shop and the "official" ZF distributor in the US. That all has changed now, but, as mentioned, if the shop (the second not the one who did the work) was Dose in El Cajon, they know what they're doing when it comes to ZF transmissions and BMW's!
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Old 09-27-2018, 05:54 PM
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Dose is the shop above. Who gave me the advice. They didn't do the drain and fill. They're located 1 hour from my location in Northern San Diego. They came recommended by local european shops in the area. The tech specifically resetting adaptations would open or could open a can of worms. He recommended the latest software from BMW if that exists or not? But then what he said contradicts the PDF service manual from ZF that says you're supposed to " reset adaptations" and do a " teach/ re-learn" on a road varying speeds, and gears, rpms etc.
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Old 09-27-2018, 07:32 PM
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While I don't know if it would open a can of worms, I've used Dose for over 20 years and they never steered me wrong. Used to live in San Diego too and took many a BMW to them for transmission service/work. A lot of the independents AND some of the dealerships used to take/send cars to them too.

In all honesty, I'm up in Northern California now and have been for a few years so I can't say I've used them recently. However, with that said, personally, I would still trust them and getting the transmission software flashed to the latest (even if it hasn't changed) will still cause the adaptations to reset to a point.

Hope you get it all worked out.
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Old 09-27-2018, 10:49 PM
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Man that is an incredible find- a BMW dealer that opens transmissions.

If they ARE a BMW dealer why wouldn't they just do the "BMW transmiission update' themselves? I mean they could just tell you based on the vin what is needed, no?
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Old 09-28-2018, 07:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ard View Post
Man that is an incredible find- a BMW dealer that opens transmissions.

If they ARE a BMW dealer why wouldn't they just do the "BMW transmiission update' themselves? I mean they could just tell you based on the vin what is needed, no?
Not sure if you're referring to Dose as a dealer, as I didn't say they were and didn't allude to them being a dealer. They're an independent ZF transmission shop and as I mentioned, really do know their stuff.

In regards to them doing the transmission update, I don't know if they would have the files to do the update. But in some ways, I'm kind of surprised if they don't. As mentioned, haven't used them in a few years and can't remember if I ever had them update the transmission software or not.

Hopefully, they are still as good as they used to be, but we all know that over time, things change. Ultimately, the final decision is up to the OP (EMT760RR).
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Old 09-28-2018, 03:15 PM
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Just to clarify. Dose has the ability to do it. They made suggestions of independents in my area who they could vouch for. That wouldn't screw up with a software update. I literally only called Dose for advice over the phone. That was it. Most of the shops in San Diego will praise Dose in El Cajon soon as you drop their name. Even the so called " highly rated" ones.

Another Indy's reaction was " Oh Dose... Yeah..chuckle. Those guys are good".

Last edited by EMT760RR; 09-28-2018 at 03:20 PM.
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