BMW named Best-of-The-Best in Total Quality Exp. for overall brand and X5

[Drum]

+1 for salesman puffery. Even if you believe the underlying claim of polling 2008 owners who bought their X5's in 2007, what could people who have only owned their vehicles for a few months really have to contribute as far as such an overall evaluation.

I guess it would be less impressive and contemporary to award such a destinction to a 2-3 year old car, assuming it would be appropriate, but that would be the best method to truly evaluate the overall quality of a thing.

My .02

D

[BGM]

Originally Posted by Drum

+1 for salesman puffery. Even if you believe the underlying claim of polling 2008 owners who bought their X5's in 2007, what could people who have only owned their vehicles for a few months really have to contribute as far as such an overall evaluation.

I guess it would be less impressive and contemporary to award such a destinction to a 2-3 year old car, assuming it would be appropriate, but that would be the best method to truly evaluate the overall quality of a thing.

My .02

D

Yes but the JD Power survey is always usually "Initial Quality" so a 2-3 year old car is not in their testing. If you want 2-3 year old car quality test read Consumer Reports--and we all know which models they are married to (Toyotas and Hondas). I'm not saying Strategic Visions survey is better but it's a sample of what owners are saying. Take it or leave it.

[juicer]

Originally Posted by deutsch100

My 2007 3.0si was so bad (from day 1 of ownership), it was returned to BMW (details are not to be discussed, per our legal agreement).

While the 2008 4.8i is better, it is not what I expect from a BMW, espeically a $70,000 model.

i-Drive failures, battery warnings, poor A/C, multiple, various and very frequent warning lights, absurdly poor gas mileage, door locks malfunctioning, auto tailgate randomly stops working, reverse camera is a total joke, no heat reflecting glass, radio/satellite pre-set buttons erase themselves, or re-set to random stations I have never used, date/time erases itself.....

I have spoken with A LOT of new X5 owners, and I know that I am not alone in believing that BMW and the X5 should not score top honors. Sorry.

I am now on my 3rd X5 and have NEVER had a problem with any of the vehicles and I have racked 100,000's kms
I would suggest that if you are that disgruntled and unhappy - sell it and move on, I wouldn't want to be driving around in a vehicle I was that unhappy with.

[deutsch100]

Originally Posted by juicer

I am now on my 3rd X5 and have NEVER had a problem with any of the vehicles and I have racked 100,000's kms
I would suggest that if you are that disgruntled and unhappy - sell it and move on, I wouldn't want to be driving around in a vehicle I was that unhappy with.

Well, I'm on my 4th X5. My 2004 X5 4.4i and 4.8is were flawless, and I enjoyed everyday and every drive in them. The 07 and 08 X5 are not as good IMO. I should have known not to buy the 07' one since it was the first batch to arrive at the dealership (with almost every German make, first year models are consumer suicide!). I assumed the 2008 would have been fully de-bugged, my mistake obviously. But still, shame on BMW for releasing this model with so many known problems (I was told by multiple service advisors, that BMW knows the transmission is a problem, they know the rear view camera is horrible, etc...)

[StanF18]

Originally Posted by deutsch100

...with almost every German make, first year models are consumer suicide...

That seems to make sense, for ANY product really. But I don't have enough experience with BMW to assess this statement since I bought the last model year of the E53 (2006), so I went with the tried and tested trim. Can other board members comment on this? Is it truly a good idea to avoid 1st year BMW models and wait for the sophomore year?

[mtech8]

deutsch100: If BMW knows that these things are a problem, are they going to do anything about it? Just surprised that they knowingly put such bad parts into their cars!

StanF18: It tends to be true to avoid 1st year models for all makes. But there are a few exceptions. My 1st year ML was really good. When I replaced it with a later year make of the same bodystyle, it wasn't as good. More problems due to using inferior materials. But I think this was an exception due to the various other factors (increased competition, constant need to reduce cost to make a profit, etc).

[Penguin]

Originally Posted by StanF18

That seems to make sense, for ANY product really. But I don't have enough experience with BMW to assess this statement since I bought the last model year of the E53 (2006), so I went with the tried and tested trim. Can other board members comment on this? Is it truly a good idea to avoid 1st year BMW models and wait for the sophomore year?

Yes.

But it's even better to wait for the Junior year. BMW tends to get the bugs ironed out in the third MY after a product is launched. For some reason BMW is rather slow to respond to most problems, although they did redo the angle of the Z4 instruments, so that people could see them clearly, a few months after the Z4 was launched. That was a quite fast response by BMW standards.

But, IMHO, the third year of a new model is the "sweet spot" for BMWs.

[bmwestcoast]

It amazes me, upon reading this forum, how many people focus on the trivial things. In all honesty I could care less about the electronics. I buy BMW (we own a 530i) for one, simple reason...the driving experience. I love the ride, the sound, the feel of these cars. I'm not too concerned on if the tailgate doesn't close (use your hand), the gas milage sucks (it's a V8...), iDrive (iDontCare), back-up camera (look over shoulder), etc. but ultimately I'm buying it for the ride.

Also, the X3 isn't technically built by BMW at the moment. It was outsourced but will be brought back to BMW and eventually built in the Spartanburg, SC plant when they complete plant expansion. So quality assurance may not be comparable to the X5 in terms in production quality...

Originally Posted by deutsch100

My 2007 3.0si was so bad (from day 1 of ownership), it was returned to BMW (details are not to be discussed, per our legal agreement).

While the 2008 4.8i is better, it is not what I expect from a BMW, espeically a $70,000 model.

i-Drive failures, battery warnings, poor A/C, multiple, various and very frequent warning lights, absurdly poor gas mileage, door locks malfunctioning, auto tailgate randomly stops working, reverse camera is a total joke, no heat reflecting glass, radio/satellite pre-set buttons erase themselves, or re-set to random stations I have never used, date/time erases itself.....

I have spoken with A LOT of new X5 owners, and I know that I am not alone in believing that BMW and the X5 should not score top honors. Sorry.

[Drum]

Originally Posted by bmwestcoast

Also, the X3 isn't technically built by BMW at the moment. So quality assurance may not be comparable to the X5 in terms in production quality...

Or it might be better...

:p

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magna_Steyr

D

[bmwestcoast]

If your implying that Magna Steyr makes better cars, I think this list speaks for itself:

• Audi
• Fiat
• 1994–1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee
• Mercedes-Benz M-Class
• Volkswagen Golf Country (1990 - 1991)
• Volkswagen Transporter Syncro (1984 - 1992)
• Bitter SC (1980s)

Current production:

• BMW X3 - 8770 produced in 2003, 34,604 in 2004
• Chrysler Voyager
• Chrysler 300
• Jeep Commander
• Jeep Grand Cherokee
• Mercedes-Benz E-Class 4MATIC - 23624 produced in 2003
• Mercedes-Benz G-Class - 6833 produced in 2003
• Saab 9-3 Cabrio - 9800 produced in 2003