X5 BMW Service Recommendation Changes?

[MRV99]

This is a pretty simple topic.

1) Master BMW mechanics which do tech talks in major BMW publications state all fluid intervals are way to long based on the way Americans commute and push their engines/components. Sludge will build up based on typical low rpm and high moisture buildup, stop and go, abusive driving on parts which are build just enough to satisfy the accounts. Let just see how many modern cars are praised like there old school counterparts are now.

2) If you purchase a BMW because of the Zero maintenance policy then you drank the coolaid and my not be able to afford the car.... people now a days don't feel that they pay for anything... everything should be free. No need to keep anything because the next best thing will come out and I will buy that. Why would you need to maintain anything when you are going to throw it away in x years. Nobody keeps anything like they used to unless they think it is going to make them money. Most people cannot afford the standards at which people live now.... Imagine spending 50-75k on a 5 year loan and actually pay 1k a year just to maintain the car... BMW would never sell the cars they do today.

3) The faster that you burn your car up the quicker you purchase a new car. Stock holders no longer care about anything except "Growth". there is no long term only short term. How can I profit now. How do you obtain growth..... new markets or sell more product to existing customers at shorter intervals. A personal quote from a CEO of a company which manufactured home appliances ...... His brother makes cheese: "Why build something which can last 20 years when you can build something that will last half as much and pay the same price"... you just doubled your sales in the same time frame.... not to mention if it fails quicker.
3) Does anybody own insurance? Insurance is for suckers unless you have to use it. BMW can view long maintenance intervals the same way. The longest interval on warranty is 100k. Mathematics dictates this...

never mind... I can rant on forever but I am going to bed.

[JCL]

Originally Posted by scollins

More certain than uncertain. I know you believe that some little widget in the sump is some sort of oil condition analyzer. In that link, you link to another thread where there is some TIS about an oil condition sensor found in N52 engines. Well, none of us have N52 engines, so that really isn't applicable.

And, if there really was a true oil condition sensor, then when I had my N54 powered 335i, would it not have increased the mileage to the next service when I did mid-cycle oil changes? Clearly the condition of my oil varied significantly, even regardless of miles, based on the Blackstone test. MY CBS never did increase the miles, it only counted down. So maybe there is a sensor, but it doesn't work for shit. If the systems are supposed "that smart", why would they suddenly become stupid and not figure out that the oil quality increased?

Also, my comment about the CBS being based mostly on fuel consumption is lifted directly from SIB 12 25 05 where is specifically states: "It is the total fuel consumption, and not the accumulated mileage, which influences when the next oil service will be forecast as due." And since we are talking about the forecast here (the stupid number in the display until the next service), my statement is accurate. The number may count down faster the closer you get to it, per the SIB, but what do we see every time we start the vehicle? The forecasted mileage to the next service of course!

In addition, that SIB was updated in July 2008, and references CBS4 (as well as models E70 and E90, which were introduced in 2007.) So it is current and up to date.

If you look up the part number for the 2005 model in the SIB, it is the same part number sensor as for the 3.0 twin turbo N54, and the 4.8 V8 in the E70 (I stopped checking parts books at that point) The SIB was just a convenient document to describe the oil condition sensor. It is also described in the E70 technical articles, so I don't think it is correct to say that it doesn't affect the X5.

You have two seemingly contradictory positions regarding your 335. You suggest that if the sensor worked, it would have extended the mileage. You also suggest that the CBS was telling you to change the oil at much too long an interval. Perhaps the mystery sensor was actually doing something and affecting the mileage count-down rate?

You are referencing the initial mile forecast for an oil service and considering it to be one and the same as the time when the oil service actually gets requested. The document you reference states that the initial forecast is based on fuel consumption, which is used to determine the interval for the first half of the said interval, at which point the count-down rate changes. We don't know why it changes, but this fits with owners that have said they changed their oil and the forecast didn't change. However, the eventual change interval does not work out to be linear with fuel consumption, as noted by several posters. So, something else is driving the oil change trigger. It may be the oil condition sensor, as BMW says, or perhaps it is something else entirely, but it is obviously not only based on fuel consumption due to simple observations and calculations.

[XXX555]

Spoke with the BMW service manager today and he confirmed that either the service light had to be on, 24 months passed since no or first oil change, 6500 miles or less in 12 months, or within 1000 miles of the iDrive computer saying service would be due...

He also confirmed that DEF is no longer flush and fill during service, just topped off.

[Armand]

Originally Posted by XXX555

Spoke with the BMW service manager today and he confirmed that either the service light had to be on, 24 months passed since no or first oil change, 6500 miles or less in 12 months, or within 1000 miles of the iDrive computer saying service would be due...

He also confirmed that DEF is no longer flush and fill during service, just topped off.

Thanks for the update.

Another thing I learned recently in a tech bulletin (posted on bimmerfest) was that you should not overfill the def reservoirs as the fluid could overflow and damage some parts. Owners don't have the right tools to know how much to put in so if I had to top off myself for whatever reason, I would play it safe. The more reason to make sure you get a complete fill at service time.

[ard]

Originally Posted by Armand

Thanks for the update.

Another thing I learned recently in a tech bulletin (posted on bimmerfest) was that you should not overfill the def reservoirs as the fluid could overflow and damage some parts. Owners don't have the right tools to know how much to put in so if I had to top off myself for whatever reason, I would play it safe. The more reason to make sure you get a complete fill at service time.

Oh please. Scare tactics to counter a swell of DIY. Do you really think a dealer will be better?

Here is a BIG HINT on how to properly fill and deal with any slight spills:

Garden hose.

Think back to all the DEF issue with people leaking DEF... BMW is surely not replacing other parts of lemoning cars due to 'hidden corrosion damage'

[XXX555]

Guess what light came on today?

When starting my X5d the service light in the guadge cluster where the seatbelt warning usually displays went on upon ignition but does not stay on.

In the iDrive under vehicle information it says oil service due with the engine in orange instead of its usual green.

I barely have 8000 miles but I bet at October 1st it went off. I'd bet this yearly trigger will be deleted as part of the "software upgrade" they will do when its serviced....

[Penguin]

Want to know how great the BMW CBS works?

My 2010 X5 diesel showed 1,800 miles to the next oil change one Morning when there was 9,000 total mileage in the odometer. I drove it 50 miles that day ans the next time I started it it said I was 50 miles overdue for an oil change.

My guess is that the oil condition sensor is not really integrated into the CBS countdown system, but that if the oil condition sensor hits some particular reading limit, it overrides the rest of the system and calls for an immediate oil change.

My X5 now has 20,000 miles on it and the CBS called for the first oil change at about 9,000 miles, and the second oil change at about 17,700 miles.

After the second oil change it shows 10,000 miles to the next oil change, and 8,000 miles to the next "Vehicle Service." I have no idea what this means, as I have never seen the oil change interval not match other service intervals; however, I am guessing that the 8K is for a fuel filter change.

In any case, for the first two oil changes, the CBS interval is averaging less than 9,000 miles between oil changes.

My X5 is used almost exclusively on the highway, with minimal in-town stop-and-go driving, e.g., it is beginning to look like the CBS thinks high-speed highway driving is harder on the diesel oil than in-town stop-and-go driving.

[JCL]

Originally Posted by Penguin

My X5 is used almost exclusively on the highway, with minimal in-town stop-and-go driving, e.g., it is beginning to look like the CBS thinks high-speed highway driving is harder on the diesel oil than in-town stop-and-go driving.

How are you comparing highway driving service intervals to in-town driving service intervals in your example? Are you comparing the 9000 mile interval to previous experience with a gasoline engine?

It seems to me more like the CBS thinks the diesel engine needs oil changes more frequently than the gasoline engine models. If so, and given the high mileage diesel owners outside North America seem to get between oil changes, it may be related to North American diesel fuel quality.

Let us know if you find out what the vehicle service light trigger is, as my 535 is also calling for a vehicle service at other than oil change intervals.

[Penguin]

Originally Posted by JCL

How are you comparing highway driving service intervals to in-town driving service intervals in your example? Are you comparing the 9000 mile interval to previous experience with a gasoline engine?

No, I am comparing it to what other people have been reporting on this message board. Since my in-town driving is almost zero, I am assuming most other people have more in-town driving than I do. By average of an oil change in less than 9,000 miles on average also seems to place my vehicle at or near the bottom of oil change intervals. Hence my comment "it is beginning to look like the CBS thinks high-speed highway driving is harder on the diesel oil than in-town stop-and-go driving," which is quite a distance from being a definitive claim or conclusion.

[XXX555]

Got my 8000 mile/annual service today. Noticed that the telephone number calling display is different since they programmed it (8:30 to 10:30am for oil/filter, def (?4 gallons) and wipers then 10:30 to 4pm for programming "upgrades" and two campaigns...)

Did not notice any difference other than the telephone display on the iDrive (improved) and that the brakes were better. Perhaps brakes just better than the X3 loaner (2010 MY) . All my contacts and destinations were preserved, fyi.