"In this corner BB, in this corner Eric" :rofl:

I think he has you on the health care ropes Eric ;)

Perhaps I missed that part. Because from what I have seen in this thread so far, you guys have made no argument other than "I don't believe the World Health Organization statistics". You've provided nothing which would make one believe that our health care system is any good, or better than that of France. We've come to an interesting day when one side of the debate can win by giving no argument except saying "I don't believe you". Surely you must have some argument better than that.

In all actuality, there's no standard means by which the quality of healthcare systems are measured worldwide. On this board we're discussing opinions based on our limited knowledge and experience. Those like Alpac may be able to provide a more accurate comparison since he's lived in both countries...

So let's just say that France's healthcare system is comparable to the US. The question I have is: How much do the tax payers pay in order to achieve care equivalent to that in the US? What are the current tax rates?

Only a small percentage of the total taxes collected is spent on health care. But let's figure out the answer to your question....

First, here is the total spending on Health care in each country (both government spending and private spending combined):

France - 10.5% of GDP
U.S. - 15.4% of GDP

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Now, here is the government spending only:

France - 8.23% of GDP
U.S. - 6.88% of GDP

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Now here is the GDP per capita in each country:

France - $41,511
U.S. - $45,575

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So now for some simple math:

Total spending annually (both government and private) per person in each country:

France - $4350
U.S. - $7018


And now for government spending only:

France - $3416
U.S. - $3135


So look at this.....even though they have a health care system that covers all of their citizens, has twice as many available hospital beds per capita as we do, their government only spends a tiny bit more on health care than our government does.

To put an actual number on the difference, we are talking $281 per person X 300 million people = $84.3 billion, or roughly the cost of keeping the Iraq war going for about 100 days. Or to put another spin on it, these rebate checks a bunch of us are getting in the mail this year total around $66 billion.

In case you are having trouble understanding why this is the case, here is a hint: Most of the money that we spend on health care does not actually pay for health care, but instead pays for profits being made by all the companies involved in health care (insurance companies, private hospitals, drug companies, etc.). Where as in a socialized system, it is non-profit, so costs are lower.

Neh, BB pretty much proved you didn't know all that much about the actual HC systems in the US, which thus...voids any commentary to it :)

Comes down to a difference between knowing something and simply having a lot of information on a certain topic I guess. And frankly, as I said before...for someone who doesn't take care of their own employees..it is kind of hard to take any commentary on the topic.

Agreed. I have been tempted multiple times to chime in here, but keep remembering my personal vow not to engage Eric in political debate. It accomplishes nothing besides irritating me.