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  #11  
Old 05-26-2005, 03:03 PM
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none of those cars you listed have serious performance tires that heat up.. BTW... I'm in the east bay in the bay area and I go through the same weather as you.. Kevin's in Palm Desert with a boxster...

Quote:
Originally Posted by RealShakaZulu
Myself and my two neighbors have had the Griot's paint on our floors for over 3 years in the SF delta where temps get to 110 in the summer and drop to frost levels in the winter. We park a Tahoe, Volvo wagon, Minivan, F500 commercial vehicle, X5, 300M and VW Beetle on the floor every day... amount of paint lift... ZERO. Prep is essential!
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  #12  
Old 05-26-2005, 03:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SANguru
none of those cars you listed have serious performance tires that heat up.. BTW... I'm in the east bay in the bay area and I go through the same weather as you.. Kevin's in Palm Desert with a boxster...
Can't imagine even serious performance tires would still be that hot unless your garage is at the end of the track...

Having said that, I still think the tiles are better.
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  #13  
Old 05-26-2005, 05:05 PM
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Anyone try POR-15 on their floor?
Jesse
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  #14  
Old 05-26-2005, 11:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X5Jay
Can't imagine even serious performance tires would still be that hot unless your garage is at the end of the track...

Having said that, I still think the tiles are better.
I agree the tiles look great and are much softer under foot, but is that the best price? Does it really cost a grand to cover a 3-car garage?
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  #15  
Old 05-27-2005, 12:08 AM
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bear in mind also that the X5 tires or your SUV tires are on a much harder compound... performance tires such as S03s on the M3, the PS2s on my M5, and PZero Neros on the Boxster S are sticky by nature. Just because something is heavier or has a larger contact patch will not necessarily lift epoxy based paint even with full painstaking etching which I did and priming and multiple coats. My dearly depart X5 with the sport package NEVER lifted anything... and try using a pyrometer... no much how much I beat on the X5, it will still never get as heated as the performance tires in the other cars.. Just a thought....

BTW.. did Brentwood or the Delta ever get up to 110 last year??? Pleasanton here gets hot but definitely not 110..


Quote:
Originally Posted by RealShakaZulu
San,

Without getting into a discussion on thermal dynamics... You are correct I do not park my Formula 1 car in the garage after a series of qualifying laps, but after driving from Santa Clara, SF and Palo Alto to Brentwood (as we do daily) in our SUVs (which are considerably heavier and generate more heat at the contact patch) our tires are as warm/hot as any performance tire on a 2 seater Boxster.

That said, I don't know why your paint lifted... but mine, my neighbors, my dad's (who drives a CL55) in S. Carolina nor my brother's (who drives a ZF1) in Salt Lake City have moved an inch. Coincidence? Maybe, but I doubt it.
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  #16  
Old 05-29-2005, 03:07 AM
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Lot's of misinformation you got there. Speed rating is the compliancy of a tire and the material to handle speed AND friction. Friction is what causes heat.. not sidewall or tire flex. M5 do not come in 19s. S03s on the M3 in 19s comes in W rating which is rated good up to 168 miles not 149. The old speed rating system with Z rated tires are tires good for 149 and up. Last time I checked you my X5 came with 18's with an H rated tire on the SPs. Take a look at the temperature rating of the tire. It will tell you a lot.. Besides, that's also a moot point since the compound of the tire caused a lot of lift also... Bottom line, back to the orginal debate.. I park my cars in your garage... it will lift whatever epoxy based paint.. guaranteed. Hence me going to composite tile. If you think that's too expensive, that's your perogative.



Quote:
Originally Posted by RealShakaZulu
A speed rating for tires is really a measure of the heat handling capabilities of the tire. As the tire rolls down the road, it flexes the sidewalls and tread to keep enough surface on the road to support the load. The flexing creates heat. The faster the flexing the more the heat. Faster flex is a result of higher speed. So higher speeds mean that the tires generate more heat. Tires have a speed rating letter index that provides information about the tire's heat handling capability. Bottom line, back to the orginal debate.. I park my cars in your garage... it will lift whatever epoxy based paint.. guaranteed.. so don't know what your point is.

M5 = ZR19
M3 = ZR18
Boxter = ZR18
X5 = WR20
Vette = ZR18

As W indicates up to 149 mph (w/o failure based on heat and load) and Z in excess of 149, a W tire reaches a operating temperature induced by load (which is greater in an SUV) and speed (as we both travel 680, I will assume we both avg in the 75-90 mph range). So unless you exceed 120 (being generous), I doubt that your tire temperature reaches a higher operating temperature and maintains it to your driveway and garage.

Pleasanton (Aug 2004)
Temperature Max Avg Min
Max Temperature 102 °F / 38 °C 87 °F / 30 °C 70 °F / 21 °C
Mean Temperature 80 °F / 26 °C 72 °F / 22 °C 64 °F / 17 °C
Min Temperature 63 °F / 17 °C 58 °F / 14 °C 54 °F / 12 °C

Brentwood (Aug 2004)
Temperature Max Avg Min
Max Temperature 111 °F / 38 °C 91 °F / 30 °C 70 °F / 21 °C
Mean Temperature 80 °F / 26 °C 72 °F / 22 °C 64 °F / 17 °C
Min Temperature 63 °F / 17 °C 58 °F / 14 °C 54 °F / 12 °C
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  #17  
Old 05-29-2005, 09:40 AM
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This is the best/most professional exchange I have seen on this site...if only this were the standard rather than the exception!
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  #18  
Old 05-29-2005, 10:09 AM
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I would definitely go for a tile solution over having to go through all of the prep work and effort to paint the floor, not to mention the potential maintenance effort. At 30% off that tiling is a steal for my 1 car garage at my townhouse (22x14).
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  #19  
Old 05-29-2005, 02:21 PM
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Still incorrect...

What you quoted was for the E60's that is NOT out yet. I have a E39 M5 but of course, I would love to get a E60 M5 soon.... standard tires that come with 02 X5 3.0 with SP were not the diamaris.. they were Michelin Radials 255 in 18's and all the guys include MD, Supergreg and KewlX5 can chime in on this...listing the tires that come with the 4.8 is well.. just a little different... the M3 wheels are 19's and they are forged... BMW upgrade from the standard 18's wheels. Both KewlX5, Jude and I have the 19's... and yes I went through 3 sets of tires on that car with the last being the aforementioned tires. Again according to the laws of physics/thermodynamics, friction is what causes heat. The lifting of epoxy based paint or anything else for that matter is really where the propensity for the paint to stick to the tire is > than that to stick to the ground.

on your point about speed rating, when are you going to be at a 100% load of the tire at speed??? W rated tires as shown in the chart has been tested good up to 85% load as per DOT rating system which is what most passenger vehicles will be (unless you got a bunch of 400lbs guys sitting in your car)
You talking about two completed different variables in the last exchange. Heat vs load. Again... heat is generated by friction. Limit of the tire is per the temperature rating of the tire.


Quote:
Originally Posted by RealShakaZulu
Well then we better contact...

BMW HQ
"Every last detail of the BMW M5 represents a fusion of sports strength and modern elegance. The exclusive 19-inch wheels , with their M radial spoke design, emphasise the dynamic good looks of the automobile by drawing attention to its short overhangs. High-speed tyres are the ideal equipment for breathtaking driving dynamics as they are the point of contact between the immense power of the M5 and the open road.

BMW USA
M3 Wheels
Tire dimensions (performance tires) - front 1 225/45R-18
Tire dimensions (performance tires) - rear 1 255/40R-18
Wheel dimensions - front/rear 18 x 8.0/18 x 9.0
Material Light Cast Alloy

TireRack
2005 BMW M3 Coupe OEM Tire = Michelin Pilot Sport
Front: 225/45ZR18

2005 BMW X5 OEM Tire = Michelin 4X4 Diamaris (hey just like mine)
Rear: 315/35WR20

Pirelli
W is rated for 149 MPH at 100% Load

and the manufacturer's testing labs
"Speed ratings are based on laboratory tests where the tire is pressed against a large diameter metal drum to reflect its appropriate load, and run at ever increasing speeds (in 6.2 mph steps in 10 minute increments) until the tire's required speed has been met" (no mention of friction)

for we have lot of misinformation.
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  #20  
Old 05-29-2005, 02:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SANguru
Still incorrect...

What you quoted was for the E60's that is NOT out yet. I have a E39 M5 but of course, I would love to get a E60 M5 soon.... standard tires that come with 02 X5 3.0 with SP were not the diamaris.. they were Michelin Radials 255 in 18's and all the guys include MD, Supergreg and KewlX5 can chime in on this..
I do not see a career in fact checking or law in your future.

The X5 referred to

"Myself and my two neighbors have had the Griot's paint on our floors for over 3 years in the SF delta where temps get to 110 in the summer and drop to frost levels in the winter. We park a Tahoe, Volvo wagon, Minivan, F500 commercial vehicle, X5, 300M and VW Beetle on the floor every day... amount of paint lift... ZERO. Prep is essential!"

as not lifting the paint was mine and I do not own an '02 X5 and definitely not a 3.0...

Your tire size is irrelevant to the speed rating which is the same...

Why would anyone buy a tire based on 85% load? Especially an SUV which is meant to tow and load more than 400lb men...

Regarding your thoughts on friction... in the words of Charlie Murphy... wrong, wrong... you incorrectly believe that it's the rolling friction that makes your tires warm due to an elementary belief that they are rubbing the roadway. That is called sliding friction and if encountered constantly on a roadway would decrease the life expectancy of tires to several weeks. In the interest of those who are become bored with this exchange (myself included) I will not explain thermal dynamics, but trust me when I say that load and flex are creating far more heat than contact.

Oh and by the way if you still think you can lift a correctly applied epoxy floor contact the BestValueinPainting.com out of Fresno they can lead you to one of their clients like Pirelli or Costco. There you can attempt to lift their paint.

We could be wrong but I doubt it.

Now I am certain you will rebuttle, but this concludes this thread for me. Look forward to seeing pictures of your tile floor and how the process went.

Last edited by RealShakaZulu; 05-29-2005 at 05:01 PM.
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