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  #1  
Old 09-12-2012, 12:34 PM
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Are dictators better?

I can't help but question whether the removal of dictators like Saddam, Mubarak, and Gadafi were good things when you see that chaos that ensues. I'm reacting to the attacks on American embassies in Egypt and Libya. That crap would never have happened when there was a dictator in power who would crush such protests. Sure, there were gross abuses of citizens and interests adverse to America but it pisses me off.

These protesters are protesting an obscure movie made by an Israeli activists living in the US, that virtually nobody has seen nor cares about but because a clip made it to YouTube and because it disparages the prophet Mohammed, these nut jobs are attacking the US and killing US diplomatic staff. Isn't it ironic that the US supported the removal of these dictators and supports the kind of freedom that allows such protests, which the masses are clearly enjoying, yet they kill over the exercise of that same freedom by a inciteful "film maker" with an agenda.

I know it is not all Islamic activists and painting them all with the same extremist brush is not fair but something has to be done to respond to this kind of attack.
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Old 09-12-2012, 10:24 PM
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Touched a nerve here
I have always questioned the wisdom at the mention of removing dictators because real expert advice on how to achieve a result is usually ignored .
That is all .
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Old 09-13-2012, 08:47 AM
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what if the Israel did this to agitate the muslims so then to have an excuse to drag the US into this pile of sh!t??? and get more money in aid to further its security agenda?...
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Old 09-13-2012, 10:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TerminatorX5 View Post
what if the Israel did this to agitate the muslims so then to have an excuse to drag the US into this pile of sh!t??? and get more money in aid to further its security agenda?...
It doesn't matter who did it for whatever reason. We have freedom of speech and we will never stop everyone from saying or doing something that will offend some nutjobs; and we should not even be trying.

If they are offended by what someone says then they have to start realizing that the world does not live by their religious rules. If they kill Americans (or any other world citizens) for insulting their profit, the we, the rest of the world have to do our best to hunt down the perpertraitors and eliminate them. Period.
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Old 09-13-2012, 10:52 AM
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A reasonable question, PNG/K...
Not a foreign policy wank, but from my POV it seems the 'dictator run' hot beds seem to keep the Taliban/zealots sort of under the thumb, for awhile. Though I suspect there is a large portion of quid pro quo between dictatorial regimes and the blatant bad guys, in most of the tipping point countries and governments.

Then when a 'dictator' gets toppled, 'the chaos', which was both partially responsible for that overthrow, and the ensuing post takeover, provides a frog pond full of bacteria to seep into the 'new gov't', imo.

The media and the bullshitting policy wonks pound their chests about 'Arab Spring', new 'democracies' and all that related 7th grade civic class bs, but the frog pond quickly evolves into the Creature from the Black Lagoon, and Bam! ...that 'new gov't' is riddled with the Taliban, et al, the zealots, and the whole joint is polarized beyond comprehension, at least incomprehensible by most of us in the 'western civilisations'.

I can't think of any/many countries that have had a serious 'regime change' that are really 'better/friendlier to US/less of a smoldering toxic fire', or that Lagoon situ.

For the under 50 set out their in HappyLand, USA this is not going 'away', gonna get better, or resolve itself anytime soon, imo. Unfortunately...
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Old 09-13-2012, 11:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TerminatorX5 View Post
what if the Israel did this to agitate the muslims so then to have an excuse to drag the US into this pile of sh!t??? and get more money in aid to further its security agenda?...
In this case I would think its unlikely...they want Iran...and unfortunately if they decide to strike Iran or any other nation around them we will be dragged into it whether we like or not...our foreign policy towards the middle east seems to be dictated by Israel

As far as gettin back to topic If gadafi was still in power it is unlikely that this would have taken place..but everyone has an agenda including our government...
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Old 09-13-2012, 11:54 AM
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well... i was taught in the investigative process one of the first questions is - who benefits from the "crime"... in this case, israel will benefit directly, as our funding towards their security will increase, and it is a known fact that we support the state of israel (foreignassistance.gov)... Otherwise, it is very interesting that a country with GDP less than Bangladesh (https://www.cia.gov/library/publicat...mde&rank=76#is) can survive such a high military spendings (7% of GDP compared to 4% for the US - but they have to do so, to defend themselves)... It seems that the current US administration is rather indifferent to the israeli problems and maybe they hope that the change of the party at the helm of US would bring them a relieve... since they can't vote directly, they instigate the "chaos" by agitating the easily agitated...

I agree with the blacktop, that we have the freedom of speech - but by the same token, should we allow a free "propaganda" by the KKK, or the NeoNazi? after all, if they do not engage into actual violence, their agenda would fall under the protected auspices of the freedom of speech, right? To be honest, I have no desire to hear out the KKK arguments for the "white power" nor the Nazi idea of superiority of the Arian Nation... also, i would appreciate if the prophets (whether Abraham, Moses, Jesus or Mohammed - all of whom are prophets under Islam) are left alone... Some people are sensetive to some things - some people don't eat nuts, some other people hide from the sun to avoid sunburns, some don't like when you criticize their parents and some don't like when you say something about their prophet... should we throw sticks and poke those people, and force-feed them nuts, just because we can? of course not, we are civilized people, we should know better...
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Old 09-13-2012, 12:18 PM
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My point is that Israel does not need to instigate anything...they have US backing no matter what...look at congress and AIPAC.
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Old 10-03-2012, 10:10 AM
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Well, if US government just arrested that asshole Jewish filmdirector and put in jail then all this would not happen.

Well, for the time being I would arrest him for the charge of abusing a religion followers.

Muslims, including me, just feel unfair for the picky way of the US govt democracy.

Millions of Iraqis were killed and injured because of a US govt lie; Saddam's nuclear weapons. Where are these weapons? now who gonna compensate for millions of widows & parentlesses? Where's George W Bush & his gang?

I'm sorry my American friends, but the US govt is fully controlled by a group of a very dirty Jews. You're being fooled you that there's democracy & elections, whereas in fact, your democracy is restricted for your burger; is it with cheese or without!
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Old 10-03-2012, 10:16 AM
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without cheese, my friend... without cheese - you can't mix meat and dairy, it is not kosher, remember?...
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