As far as I know it was only the RR 3.0 litre that got the BMW Diesel engine and best not to forget that the Freelanders 2.0litre diesel engine is also BMW and I tell you that is a sweet wee enigne.:thumbup:

The 330d can shift:thumbup: even the 120d can shift and you can spec the particular filter:thumbup: Don't know about the rest haven't driven them.

I was just thinking about this thread today as we started up the X'er to go shopping and had a wee smile on my face at the sound of our diesel engine.:)

I still can't get my head round how they wouldn't meet USA emission laws of course the quality of fuel in America is not as great as ours as you ofter hear JC from Topgear referring to.:confused:

Great info X5Sport.Not bad ,hei,the 535D coming 3rd in best engine overall!Not bad for an engine some like to say is unrefined and compare it to a tractor!Surely,it cant be a Diesel??:rolleyes:

Regarding the number 2 spot occupied by the little VW 1.4 litre engine(121Hp/ltr),I agree that this should be where it is and that VW are to be congratulated on this great little engine which although only has 1.4 ltr ,has both a compressor and a Turbo,packs a 170 bhp punch with the help of a compressor that helps build up boost for the Turbo for mid to high rpm .

The Diesel again grabbing the honours on the 2.5 to 3.0 ltr class ,over the I6 is also amazing since the I6 is a great engine.

I hate the M5!It won everything!Not surprisingly!Massive engine.

Scottie,

Just ask Bosch Corp how great the diesel is here in the U.S.A!! They may have a few fuel injectors to prove it.

Agreed, but we're also the world's largest economy, so per capita, how do assess our collective carbon footprint?

It would an interesting exercise to reverse the populations and economies of Australia or Canada with that of the USA...would consumption trends migrate? Interesting scenario, 289 million Australians, no? That's a lot of lager. :)

And what exacts a greater toll in resources? Refining, delivering, and burning a gallon of diesel, or a gallon of gasoline? And what would be the collateral environmental cost in terms of respiratory illness from particulates if the ratio of gasoline vs diesel vehicles in the USA was reversed?

If you look at the effect of recent fuel prices on the sales of monstrosities like the Ford Excursion and the Hummer H2, it is evident that increased fuel prices are a godsend in terms of getting people to rethink their choice of vehicles.

Hmmm, yes, a good debate. Most of this is about a Landrover Discovery, but some of it applies to the BMW X5.

Yes, but they were comparing it to the old Landrover diesel, not a petrol engine. It revved very easily for a diesel, all the way up to 4200 or so.

The BMW 3.0 diesel is much smoother than the TD5, no argument at all. I haven't driven recent BMW diesel saloons, but I have been a passenger. I have driven many recent diesels in the UK and Europe, from other European manufacturers. I think that most of them are very impressive, for diesels. IMO, and it is only my opinion, BMW diesels are not as smooth as BMW petrol engines. All of the reports say things like "very smooth....for a diesel." I agree.

I know all about BMW sales figures for diesels in North America. Zero. ;) We were discussing the US and Canada, not Europe or Oceania.

Basically, brand distillation. I think that a diesel in North America will weaken the BMW brand. BMW has a certain amount of money to invest in new engine product development. I just hope that they spend it on future engine technology, like the DI product, and not on the diesels. That is self-interest, because I want to buy a new generation DI, but I won't buy a diesel. A lot of US members here have not driven an X5 diesel. A lot of us have driven US diesel pickups. We know that diesels can get better fuel economy. We know about massive torque. However, if some further development was put into the 3.0 DI twin turbo petrol engine, it would be very close to the diesel in brake specific fuel consumption. The turbos would help a lot with torque. The fuel would be cheaper and easier to find, and wouldn't smell as much. The engine would rev higher. The engine would be smoother, because of the lower peak cylinder pressures.

Perhaps I can express it a different way. BMW is developing the V5. It is a minivan, in another guise. I wish they would spend the product development money on future engines. I would be likely to buy products with future engines. I will never buy a V5 minivan. I am sure it will be a very nice minivan. I just don't want one, and I think it waters down the brand. Just my opinion. At the end of the day, it doesn't matter what I think, they will build one anyway. And then, we can all bear the soccer-mom jokes again.

Always a good debate, Fernando. :thumbup:

Jeff

Arnie is a communist? Really? :rofl:

I think that New York's emission regs will block many modern diesels, not just California's. One report I saw said that 40% of the US car market would be blocked, I think it was from three states.

Why don't I think diesels will help? If every gasoline engine instantly became a diesel, that would help a lot. 10% less oil imports, or something like that. However, that isn't the way consumers will get diesels. Many will think, hmm, do I want an midsize car, or should I get a large sport utility with a diesel (assuming each has the same mileage). I fear many would choose door number 2. If the choice was between a midsize car with a gasoline engine, and a diesel version with more fuel efficiency, would the diesel win? North American buying habits seem to indicate that consumers will buy the larger vehicle, as the diesel helps them rationalize the purchase.

I am not attacking you in any way here, you may have very good reasons to own a 3/4 ton pickup, but let me set out a comparison to illustrate a point. You got 22.3 mpg. Excellent for a pickup. But are there any vehicles that you could have made the same trip in that got better mileage? Maybe you were pulling a trailer, or carrying a camper. Maybe your work tools need a vehicle of that GVW. But where I live, there are a lot of people commuting in pickups as a lifestyle choice. Choice is great, but another example: I park under an office tower downtown. A few spaces over is a Super Duty crewcab with an 8' box. Empty bed. Large wheels. Very loud diesel. I don't know, but I would be very surprised if it isn't chipped. Single occupant, commuter. Takes him 10 minutes to get it into the rather tight underground space. He can afford the vehicle, good for him. However, if we all drove to work in trucks like that, we would be in even more trouble than we are now. Maybe I should just be thankful he is driving a diesel, and not a pickup with a very large gasoline engine.

Bio Diesel? Lots of subsidies there. Doesn't seem like a free-market solution. Maybe that will change. Oh, and foreign oil? I should show my colours here.... I am one of those foreigners. We are your largest source of oil imports. If you have to import it, I want you to get it from us :)

Yes, diesels will help. In light trucks, I think they are the right choice. But across the broader automotive spectrum, from a high level, I think consumers will choose more efficient vehicles (and use their current vehicles less) when fuel costs a lot more. I think it would be less painful for the planet if that happened sooner instead of later. And no, I don't own stock in an oil company.

This is all a bit philosophical, but interesting. Thanks for the comments.

Jeff

Hmmm, we should probably get back to BMWs. Quick answers:

Response 1: The Discovery Series II came out in 1998. The 2001 redesign was not called a Series III. Some called it a 2.5. The wheelbase changed, third row seating was now possible in practice and not just in theory, the tail lights were mounted higher, there was an active suspension option to keep it from heeling so much in the corners, etc. The engine was further refined according to Landrover (and yes, I agree with that, it was better than the 2000 version).

Response 2: Yes, it was a TD5. Not the original LandRover diesel that carried on in the Defender series for some time, but the new design that was not finalized when BMW purchased Landrover. BMW was involved in the product development. The engine had modern features like electronic unit injectors, and so on, making it very current at the time. The BMW connection was promoted by the UK dealers (since it was not the same version as the old LandRover engine, they referred to it as the BMW version). I agree that it was not developed by BMW. I can't imagine the Bavarian engineers quietly accepting a 5 cylinder design.

The link you provided refers to the 1999 version of the TD5 engine, not the later redesign.

Taking a company lease out on the Discovery was fairly safe, compared to spending my own cash money on a Plus 4 with a T16 2 litre Rover engine. That took guts. ;)

Jeff

Very good point,my friend!If the World is all for saving energy resources,why not import the diesel if its so much more economicalYour are right,it doesnt make sense!

Australia is just catching on the diesel trend. I was truely amazed when I first drove the 3.0 diesel. So much so that I bought an X3 3.0 Diesel. Tried every other brand and the BMW just stood out, so much so it made their petrol 3.0 seem boring...and used less fuel in the process. :thumbup:

You say"lets talk about Bmw",yet both your responses are mainly about the Disco!I will reply nevertheless!
1.After I give you some data,you now say that the Disco had a change in 1998,whilst in your post #25 you say it was in 2001!Dont bring restyling into this since the debate here is engines,and Diesel not DI petrol!
The Disco had the TD5 engine from 1998 thru to the latest LR3!
You are all wrong ,Jeff,!I never said that the engine was better than the 2000 version!How could I?I mean,the Disco had the VM engine up to 1998,after this came the TD5!Nothing refined here!It was a completely new LR ONLY engine!

2.Talking about contradicting yourself!Was it or was it not developed by Bmw?The Real 2.5 Bmw engine was in the RR and that was a 6-cylinder,as I told you remember!:)
You dont need to tell me about the TD5 engine!I gave you the link?:rolleyes:
Never heard the TD5 engine being called BMW!Fiat bought out Ferrari a while ago,never heard of a Fiat engine Ferrari !Although Fiat did put the Ferrari V8 in a Lancia!
It was never "the old LR engine",it was a VM Italian design!
I agree with you,a 5-cylinder Diesel Bmw wouldnt look good,which why Bmw left the TD5 in the Disco and used their own,smooth but 20 year old 2.5-I6 in the top of the range RR!

The link I gave you is for ALL versions of the TD5 the non-Bmw engine in question here!The engine you so heavily criticise!
The later Disco version has RR own design!