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  #31  
Old 01-27-2019, 11:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wpoll View Post
Yeah, I get that (I do this sort of thing for a living!) but I still can't believe that the factory setup (in some cases) has two power amps in series.. no wonder it sounds like crap!
That's been like every BMW from the 1990s-mid 2000s. Nothing new.
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Last edited by tmaxx445; 01-27-2019 at 11:54 PM.
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  #32  
Old 01-27-2019, 11:43 PM
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Originally Posted by wpoll View Post
Kinda like what I have in my car - but in my case it's the speaker wires in the dash, not wiring running to a second amp.

But why put two power amps in series? That's just dumb...
Everything has a amp in it to feed a given signal to another amp. Even home stereos. But if its line level the power is very weak. If you know what your going to have coming in for an input on a given amp you can adjust for it and have no real quality issues. The factory setup (non dsp) is designed to have x signal coming in which in this case is a higher power amplified signal than say line level. The factory radio even has more raw power out than most of the aftermarket radios speaker level outputs so it normally just works fine.
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  #33  
Old 01-27-2019, 11:44 PM
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Wpoll: They just start with one head unit and add on additional more powerful amps for the higher tier factory stereo options with more speaker outputs for more drivers. They amps just get 4 ch high level input and the crossover network is built into the amp itself.
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  #34  
Old 01-27-2019, 11:45 PM
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Originally Posted by tmaxx445 View Post
The OP's factory hifi amp is still in place and further amplifying the already high level signal coming from the Eonon unit. That is the likely point of distortion he is looking to solve.
Exactly - and my apologies for confusing this thread but all the info I have indicates that a BM54 DOES in fact act as an amp and I assumed (incorrectly it seems) that no car maker would put two power amps in series... sheesh...

Here's some info on the BM54 that states that it contains an amp (of output power 15-20 watts)...
Carphonics - Car System Repairs and Upgrades

The Eonon output stage is probably overdriving the factory amp input stage - lowering the output level from the Eonon will reduce the distortion but the quality of the audio may be compromised by this entire setup....
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  #35  
Old 01-27-2019, 11:48 PM
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Originally Posted by wpoll View Post
Exactly - and my apologies for confusing this thread but all the info I have indicates that a BM54 DOES in fact act as an amp and I assumed (incorrectly it seems) that no car maker would put two power amps in series... sheesh...

Here's some info on the BM54 that states that it contains an amp (of output power 15-20 watts)...
Carphonics - Car System Repairs and Upgrades

The Eonon output stage is probably overdriving the factory amp input stage - lowering the output level from the Eonon will reduce the distortion but the quality of the audio may be compromised by this entire setup....
Yep I realize the BM54 has a small internal amp, in some markets the base cars only that to drive the speakers. Typically those cars only have 4 speakers or maybe 6 with just an inline cap before the tweeter. All US cars have external amps and yes they have a "high" level signal input from the BM54 module.
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  #36  
Old 01-27-2019, 11:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Crowz View Post
Everything has a amp in it to feed a given signal to another amp. Even home stereos. But if its line level the power is very weak. If you know what your going to have coming in for an input on a given amp you can adjust for it and have no real quality issues. The factory setup (non dsp) is designed to have x signal coming in which in this case is a higher power amplified signal than say line level. The factory radio even has more raw power out than most of the aftermarket radios speaker level outputs so it normally just works fine.
Thanks Crowz - I know all that - I design audio amps... But clearly the designers of this system had no concern (or understanding) of the basics of maximum power transfer (efficiency) and impedance matching. Power level outputs are a crap way to feed power amps.

But I guess is DOES make for less wiring and more easily configured modular systems and that is more important in auto manufacturing than audio quality....
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  #37  
Old 01-27-2019, 11:49 PM
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Originally Posted by wpoll View Post
Exactly - and my apologies for confusing this thread but all the info I have indicates that a BM54 DOES in fact act as an amp and I assumed (incorrectly it seems) that no car maker would put two power amps in series... sheesh...

Here's some info on the BM54 that states that it contains an amp (of output power 15-20 watts)...
Carphonics - Car System Repairs and Upgrades

The Eonon output stage is probably overdriving the factory amp input stage - lowering the output level from the Eonon will reduce the distortion but the quality of the audio may be compromised by this entire setup....
Might be his problem. The eonon claims to put out 45 watts. The difference is the 20 watts the bm54 can do is rms and the eonon is peak so that kind of leaves it up in the air as to what it really puts out.

At the same time overdriving an amp always equals distortion so its possible if its putting out more than the main amp is setup for.
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  #38  
Old 01-27-2019, 11:50 PM
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Originally Posted by wpoll View Post
Thanks Crowz - I know all that - I design audio amps... But clearly the designers of this system had no concern (or understanding) of the basics of maximum power transfer (efficiency) and impedance matching. Power level outputs are a crap way to feed power amps.

But I guess is DOES make for less wiring and more easily configured modular systems and that is more important in auto manufacturing than audio quality....
Bingo, its all about streamlining the parts stock and manufacturing process. Everything related to in-car audio is a compromise anyway. No way to match a proper in-home hifi setup given the environment inside a moving car.
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  #39  
Old 01-27-2019, 11:59 PM
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EONON Amp vs BMW HI-Fi Amp (bypass?)

Just for reference:



And more specifically the “DSP” system:




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Last edited by tmaxx445; 01-28-2019 at 12:12 AM.
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  #40  
Old 01-28-2019, 12:27 AM
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Oh man, I really got things going... My setup looks very similar to the picture you posted for the cubby hole.

Even with reducing the EONON to -15db (lowest setting) the sound quality is meh... So from what I'm gathering... The only way to really get this tuned in is to basically rewire the whole car?

I added my cubby and amp pictures for confirmation. For the amp you need to zoom in, but it has the info that I posted on the original post.
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