CCV Valve - Oil Separation Failure due to cold weather...anyone else?

bman05 · #1 02-12-2010, 03:54 PM

So here is my story. I live in downstate NY and for the last several weeks we've been experiencing a cold snap (low 20's and teens) and two weeks ago my 2003 BMW X5 with 51,535 miles on it simply would not start. I thought it initially was an electrical issue, however upon changing the battery, pulling all fuses and checking all connections, I could not get my vehicle started.

I ended up getting the vehicle towed to BMW and received the diagnosis that the CCV valve "froze" in the open position and sucked oil into my engine, causing it to hydrolock. The estimate to repair this damage (drain engine of oil, replace hoses and plugs, etc) is $2,150 and there's no guarantee that there is no engine damage.

I called BMWNA and spoke to an extremely unhelpful and unpersonable rep there ( Nate Grimash at ext. 7744 ) and after a full week or so of playing phone tag (mostly me calling him), he informed me that BMWNA will not assist me in any way as my X5 is just over 1,000 miles out of warranty. I requested some "goodwill" assistance from BMWNA (a warranty labor rate as opposed to retail or some help with the parts) and was flatly refused. I was told "things like this happen". I have never been so disappointed in a car manufacturer before and will most likely sell this X5 after the repair and go to another brand.

While I understand the vehicle is out of warranty (by a little over 1 thousand miles) and the CCV valve failure is due partly to weather and partly to wear, there is a definite design flaw in this vehicle. Plain and simple. I've spoken with BMW techs who have seen dozens of these problems and it all could have been avoided for an inexpensive fix.

I am equally amazed that this vehicle is prone to this type of failure due to short trips in cold weather. There is a Technical Services Bulletin (TSB 11 08 03) that deals with a fix for this issue (heated vent lines), however I was never informed of this issue and I don't believe many owners were. Isn't a cold weather package SAV designed for cold weather use? Should I move South to avoid this issue? How many BMW's are there in cold weather climes that have experienced this problem? I bet they are in the thousands. Class action time.

I've spoken with several BMW techs in my area and there are a plethora of X5's that have been coming into local dealerships for this repair in recent weeks in the New York area. I've also done no small amount of research on this issue and have found that this problem is rampant in the X-5. How BMWNA can market a vehicle (SAV with the cold weather package!) in the NE that is prone to such a catastrophic failure due to, ostensibly, COLD WEATHER is beyond my comprehension. I was essentially informed that, in order to avoid this problem, I would have to drive the car for approximately 15-20 minutes each time. This is sheer lunacy. My vehicle had zero warning signs (regular oil changes, no warning puffs of smoke, no idling issues, no oil loss, etc) and simply siezed up on me.

There is some talk about litigation (class action) for this issue and I'd like to learn if anyone has pursued this. I work in NYC and handle litigation for a business and would love to see this pursued if meritorious. I have a hard time believing that such a well-engineered machine is prone to catastrophic failure due to, ostensibly, cold weather, repeated short trips and a valve.

My dealership is being conciliatory, however even a few bucks off will result in a $2k bill for me. I've been driving BMWs for years and realize that repairs (and sometimes expensive repairs) come hand in hand with BMW ownership, but the fact that a $50 valve failed due to a condition that BMW was WELL aware of and refused to address, resulting in a $2k bill to me, is unimagineable.

My faith in BMW is shaken. I did not even mention to BMWNA the gas pedal that broke 400 miles out of warranty that I paid for, the radio button that broke 600 miles out of warranty that I was quoted $450 to fix and the folding mirrors that failed 700 miles out of warranty that I haven't had the heart to get a quote on.

Class action suit? Perhaps. Feel free to share your oil separator/CCV valve horror story and if you were successful in getting BMWNA or your dealership to help.

Brendan

NY98M3 · #2 02-12-2010, 04:02 PM

Welcome to owning a BMW!

bman05 · #3 02-12-2010, 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NY98M3

Welcome to owning a BMW!

Not exactly the productive commentary I was soliciting (this is my third BMW, by the way).

Let's try to keep this constructive. I am considering putting in the time and energy to commence a class action litigation. I've been handling litigation cases for over 10 years and would love to work on this one personally.

FSETH · #4 02-12-2010, 04:19 PM

Sorry that happened to you. It is a pretty common issue that many people on this forum are aware of. Seems to be a post about it every single day. This member got BMW to pick up the tab and he was out of warranty as well. Maybe you could call this dealer or find one who is willing to cooperate with you.

http://www.xoutpost.com/bmw-sav-foru...na-pickup.html

Edit; Sorry, I thought this dealer was in NY as well. Also, if you want to find more information on it, do a search for "oil seperator" at the top right of the page and see how many threads there are regarding this issue.

motordavid · #5 02-12-2010, 05:17 PM

Sorry to read; arbitrary and draconian that BMW NA won't cover all/some of the
repair as you are barely past warranty time, and it is a somewhat common failure
of those parts/system, for any one living in the northern climes.
Good luck with the arm wrestle.
BR, mD

jpnut · #6 02-12-2010, 05:26 PM

I am with that issue currently and got quote 1300 with potential for 1500 if spark plugs have oil. I am at 85k miles, it is a common problem as the boards will tell you. My BMWNA rep has been dodging my phone calls.

c4racer · #7 02-12-2010, 05:37 PM

I guess this SUV isn't made for driving in the cold. Because it never gets cold in Germany I can see how BMW never considered this in their design.... Oh wait a minute...

I have nothing productive to add other than sharing the misery that if/when I start using this as my ski vehicle I could run into this issue at a very in-opportune time. And seems the fix isn't really a fix, but just improving the situation a little bit.

So should I do the fix pro-actively, or is there no point?

In normal operation I drive more than 15-20 min at a time, not to mention I live in a warm climate and the X5 is garaged on top of that. So it probably will never happen to me around home. But up in the sierra's is another matter - I cannot afford to have a ticking time bomb that might go off when I am 250miles away from home.

This stuff makes me consider just selling it and getting something that will be reliable in cold weather. Too bad, I really like the X5, but this issue is far more than a simple inconvienence....

FSETH · #8 02-12-2010, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by c4racer

So should I do the fix pro-actively, or is there no point?

I am no pro, but I would make sure you changed the oil before heading out on that trip and also make sure the car is running long enough to burn off any condensation (20+ minutes at a time).

The op in the thread I linked mentioned the following; BMW is coming out with a heated oil separator in addition to the heated wrap that is installed on the plumbing to the OS. That may be worth looking into if you will be spending a significant amount of time in freezing weather.

c4racer · #9 02-13-2010, 02:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FSETH

I am no pro, but I would make sure you changed the oil before heading out on that trip and also make sure the car is running long enough to burn off any condensation (20+ minutes at a time).

The op in the thread I linked mentioned the following; BMW is coming out with a heated oil separator in addition to the heated wrap that is installed on the plumbing to the OS. That may be worth looking into if you will be spending a significant amount of time in freezing weather.

If they had a permanent fix, I would probably go for it. So the heated unit is not out yet then? I guess I will wait until it is then.

And meanwhile continue to drive my perfectly reliable in any weather car since the SUV can't handle the cold.....

FSETH · #10 02-13-2010, 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by c4racer

If they had a permanent fix, I would probably go for it. So the heated unit is not out yet then? I guess I will wait until it is then.

And meanwhile continue to drive my perfectly reliable in any weather car since the SUV can't handle the cold.....

The heated wrap that is out right now is supposed to help prevent this issue, but the heated seperator should be the final fix from what I have read.

Also keep in mind that all engines are different. Some BMW engines have this issue, but Audi/VW are notorious for oil sludge build-up issues that BMW does not have.

Short trips where the engine, fluids, exhaust, etc. doesn't get up to operating temperatures are bad for any vehicle. Not just BMW's.