Xoutpost.com - winter tires?

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Quote:

Originally Posted by bcredliner (Post 969069)

I don't agree with several of the posts.

If you are in an area where it snows significantly and often the safest practice is snow tires on all four wheels even if you have a two wheel drive vehicle.

If you are in an area where more often than not the roads are clear, most all season tires will be all around better performers and wear far less.

Higher rpms do not improve traction or vehicle control.

Downshifting either a stick or automatic compromises control. It is not as predictable and not something most of use are experienced or talented doing.

Holding your transmission in a mid range gear increases the potential to maximize control and traction due to less shifting and the greater ease to moderate throttle input efficiently.

The question of what is the best winter tire is far less important than how one drives. What is far more effective is---drive slower, reduce and modulate all driving inputs and extend your considerations for what you do a greater distance down the road. As an example--turn the wheel slower and as little as possible, drive like you have a raw egg under your foot, push on the brake slower and less. If you need to stop as fast as possible, stomp on the brake to get ABS going and then let up until the pulsing is quite slow. The majority of us are far less talented than the combination of our ABS and DCS systems. If at 40mph you look a block down the road consider everything that is going on a block and a half.

There's more but I expect I have ruffled enough feathers as it is.

I don't disagree with your list (no feathers ruffled here) but I would put a qualifier on your first two points. You define the deciding factor for needing winter tires as snowfall quantity, when in fact it is usually temperature. We use 7 C here as the breakpoint for winter tires (not snow tires); I think that is probably close to the 45 F noted above. Even without snow on the ground (like where I live, near the ocean so a temperate climate and limited snowfall) winter tires are a great advantage, and always on four wheels. I made sure both our daughters had them when they started driving, usually something like a Michelin X Ice or equivalent Bridgestone. Snow is actually easier to drive on than ice. Once it gets to -20 C or so the roads can be pretty good, snow or not. But not with tires that harden up below 7 C. There are few all season tires that remain sticky when cold.

I took my Z4 out once around Christmas, beautiful sunshine, top down. A relaxed drive. It was about -2 C or so. Roads were perfectly dry, no ice. The stock summer performance tires were incredibly slippery.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bcredliner (Post 969069)

The question of what is the best winter tire is far less important than how one drives. What is far more effective is---drive slower, reduce and modulate all driving inputs and extend your considerations for what you do a greater distance down the road. As an example--turn the wheel slower and as little as possible, drive like you have a raw egg under your foot

You're taking all the fun out of driving in the snow! It's the only time of year that it's possible to drive/experience drifting (not Tokyo style) at safer speeds. That is one thing is was disappointed in after getting my first set of Blizzaks, it was much harder to slide or spin the tires.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bcredliner (Post 969069)

If at 40mph you look a block down the road consider everything that is going on a block and a half.

:iagree: In fact, everyone should practice looking as far ahead (and behind and all around) as possible at all times.
Just avoid the practice of staring off into the distance as that tends to increase your odds of a mishap. Avoid staring in general, keep your eyes moving, develop a routine. Look 2 blocks ahead, check interior mirror, look 1 block ahead, check left mirror and blind spot, look ahead 3 blocks, check right mirror and blind spot, look ahead 4 blocks, repeat every 10-15 seconds or more depending on your speed and traffic and weather.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JCL (Post 969121)

Good point. While outside temperature would not be my first priority, I should have at least mentioned it is important to consider how much performance the tires may lose based on outside temperature. My usual consideration for temperature is more about whether I go out at all--yes or no leans to the no side at anything below freezing--has nothing to do with tire performance--it's too cold if you don't wear socks and, in Dallas, you don't have to make that decision more than around ten days a year.

Driving on ice is certainly more difficult than on snow. Some tires will help more than others but I think without good technique it is still a good bet it will be a ditch trip, fender bender, tree toppler, curb murder or OMG moment for that other thread.

Some clarification--my thoughts concerning tires are confined to X5s and even then very generalized. As an obvious example, a specific tire decision should be made with the model/year X, current tires in mind (plus a bunch of other stuff). I didn't consider vehicles like a Z4. If I had I would have suggested to never change the tires for winter, keep it in the garage and only take it out on days like you mention---for the thrill and enjoyment without going a 100mph to do so. I suspect we share that easily challenged not mentioned to the family viewpoint.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bcredliner (Post 969248)

My usual consideration for temperature is more about whether I go out at all--yes or no leans to the no side at anything below freezing--has nothing to do with tire performance--it's too cold if you don't wear socks and, in Dallas, you don't have to make that decision more than around ten days a year.

This is driving a heated car, right? You are going soft down there.

The cycling forum I frequent uses the tagline HTFU in these cases. :rofl: I was out cycling last Sunday, at -4C, for about 3 hours. Roads were dry, sun was out. Good traction with 110 psi in the Continentals, but no extreme cornering.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JCL (Post 969289)

Sounds like fun. ( Not really, I just don't want anyone to think I'm soft). I remember the days of souped up snowmobiles. Out all day and half the night, snowing and blowing, temp in the teens and thinking what can be better than this--as years have passed---- almost anything is better than getting cold.

Well it seems like we are going to have a really cold winter and we just got dumped on yesterday, with snow. So I decided to have these winter tires mounted. I have to say they are pretty freaking awesome. The car handles great with them on. Noticeable in every aspect. Only annoying thing is that I usually go to discount tire but they weren't open today so I went to a local shop. It seems like they did the worst balancing job ever. The more I think about it I think I'm best off just throwing these tires on my 3.0 sport wheels and then picking up a set of wheels I like more in the spring. I may go up a size and get new tires also. I can probably justify running winter tires for 5-6 months out of the year so I think it will work out good.

I was already pretty annoyed as I waited there for 2 hours just to have the tires mounted. I don't feel like going back there at all. I'm gonna call in Monday and tell them they suck and I want my money back for the balancing so I can go somewhere that actually knows how to balance a tire.

I hate that too. I've seen shops fail to remove the old tape weights and just add new ones. Or, not even add weights figuring nobody will notice with snow tires.
I prefer Discount Tire also, but I'm considering using Costco for my next set.

Turns out it was just snow lining the rims that I couldn't see in the dark that was throwing them off balance. These wheels really like to hold snow the set on my xi never did that. It's pretty freaking unbelievable the traction these things get tho. Between these tires and the traction control system this is by far the best handling car I have ever driven in snow. I would really encourage anyone in cold climates to consider winter tires it really improves the driving so much. It pretty freaking fun to be honest.

Sort of a a funny turn of events tho. I called in and explained the situation. The guy told me to bring the car in which I said no shot (I just don't have the time to wait there again). So he just says okay we'll refund you the money for balancing. I told the guy I'd prefer he hold off until I go to discount as I don't want to be given a refund if they did their job. He says its fine and just refunds me the money. So I got home and noticed the snow in the daylight, cleaned it all off and the balancing appears great. I called the guy back and old him to cancel the refund and he just says no its fine I'm sure you'll be in again. Well now I feel like I have to but I don't really want to. . .

I get the snow buildup on my cars' wheels also, but typically only when rallying around doing doughnuts.

I don't have any respect for a person who claims to be a car enthusiast, driving an all wheel drive vehicle, who isn't strongly compelled to find the nearest large open parking lot when a new snow fall comes and proceed to tear that snow up. So yes that was the case but I always did that in my xi and never had this issue. I'm pretty sure these wheels just like to hold it more.

Honestly even if you don't like rallying around in snow I think it is important to know how your car will handle when and if you loose traction and how you can regain control. I know it has helped me out a couple times.