When will you sell your X5?

[nick325xit 5spd]

Originally Posted by Mr.Couch

I understand based on your previous post for your E30 m3 that you have ordered plenty of BMW Classic parts. E46 & E39 parts are still being produced & are older than the E53. The classic catalog? Are you talking about this list of parts https://www.bmwgroup-classic.com/en/...oductions.html

BMW Classic is reproducing specific parts that have become high demand through worldwide ordering requests to my understanding of that system. I'm not sure who makes them vs who makes the non classic branded parts but they do state that they are a reproduction or the original part.

If you use the ETK or look at, say, RealOEM, you will see which cars have been moved to the Classic catalog. The E39 has actually been moved to Classic. (RealOEM can be slow to update this, but that will show up.) Weirdly, the E38 doesn't appear to have been moved yet. But I would expect that the E53, E46, and E38 will all moved to the Classic catalog relatively soon.

And what I'm trying to convey is that BMW Classic used to be very different and much better. Somewhere a little over 10 years ago, BMW issued a press release declaring that they would reorient Classic around increased profit vs. preserving heritage, and everything went downhill.

Edit: It used to be called BMW Mobile Tradition. It was the replacement of Mobile Tradition with Classic that marked both a decline in quality and a dramatic increase in prices.

[bcredliner]

Originally Posted by nick325xit 5spd

If you use the ETK or look at, say, RealOEM, you will see which cars have been moved to the Classic catalog. The E39 has actually been moved to Classic. (RealOEM can be slow to update this, but that will show up.) Weirdly, the E38 doesn't appear to have been moved yet. But I would expect that the E53, E46, and E38 will all moved to the Classic catalog relatively soon.

And what I'm trying to convey is that BMW Classic used to be very different and much better. Somewhere a little over 10 years ago, BMW issued a press release declaring that they would reorient Classic around increased profit vs. preserving heritage, and everything went downhill.

Edit: It used to be called BMW Mobile Tradition. It was the replacement of Mobile Tradition with Classic that marked both a decline in quality and a dramatic increase in prices.

This is the first time you have mentioned Classic parts as the issue. E53 parts, according to you, are not considered classic parts so it isn't applicable to the E53.

It is not unusual the new old parts are redesigns of the original part. Sometimes it is due to new technology, sourced from a new vendor or to keep the cost in line. One reason a classic part might cost more is the production runs are often smaller. Smaller production runs often increase the cost of a part dramatically. Again, finding parts that don't meet your standards does not mean "EVERYTHING went downhill from there". The same standards for quality apply. IMO since this is an E53 forum, your experiences don't necessarily apply to our X5s.

[nick325xit 5spd]

Originally Posted by bcredliner

This is the first time you have mentioned Classic parts as the issue. E53 parts, according to you, are not considered classic parts so it isn't applicable to the E53.

It is not unusual the new old parts are redesigns of the original part. Sometimes it is due to new technology, sourced from a new vendor or to keep the cost in line. One reason a classic part might cost more is the production runs are often smaller. Smaller production runs often increase the cost of a part dramatically. Again, finding parts that don't meet your standards does not mean "EVERYTHING went downhill from there". Regardless, the same standards for quality apply.

You've literally said in this thread that you doubt that BMW would redesign an old part. Now you're saying the exact opposite?

And Classic is VERY relevant to the E53. Why? Because the E53 is likely to end up in the Classic catalog within the next few years. Under the Mobile Tradition regime, BMW did a much better job of maintaining parts availability at original quality levels (or at least close). Under Mobile Tradition, I could trust that a part that came over the BMW counter was as likely to be decent as any other Genuine part. Under Classic, I can't.

[bcredliner]

Originally Posted by nick325xit 5spd

You've literally said in this thread that you doubt that BMW would redesign an old part. Now you're saying the exact opposite?

And Classic is VERY relevant to the E53. Why? Because the E53 is likely to end up in the Classic catalog within the next few years. Under the Mobile Tradition regime, BMW did a much better job of maintaining parts availability at original quality levels (or at least close). Under Mobile Tradition, I could trust that a part that came over the BMW counter was as likely to be decent as any other Genuine part. Under Classic, I can't.

No, I said MFGs don't redesign old parts. When volumes get low MFGs often put the part out for bid to several new potential vendors. They may require a quote as per original design or leave that open for vendor to determine what the design will be. MFGs will test sample parts to see if it meets their standards before they place an order.

We have gone from quality issues with all BMW parts, to specifically classic parts to speculation that the quality will decline when the E53 parts become classic parts. Nevertheless, I respect your opinion.

[nick325xit 5spd]

Originally Posted by bcredliner

No, I said MFGs don't redesign old parts. When volumes get low MFGs often put the part out for bid to several new potential vendors. They may require a quote as per original design or leave that open for vendor to determine what the design will be. MFGs will test sample parts to see if it meets their standards before they place an order.

That's factually incorrect. I'll give a positive example of the E30 heater valve, which was explicitly redesigned in house by BMW Classic. I'll admit that they did nice work on this one!

As for testing, well, who the hell tested the spark plug tool that couldn't fit in the S14 spark plug hole? They shipped it! It literally had one job!

We have gone from quality issues with all BMW parts, to specifically classic parts to speculation that the quality will decline when the E53 parts become classic parts. Nevertheless, I respect your opinion.

I can make a good argument that the average level of quality in newer BMWs is a lot lower. Just look at how well N20s/N54s/N55s are aging.

But it's a lot harder to make a statistical argument based on anecdata. I have hard evidence of BMW substituting low quality, or even completely unsuitable parts on the Classic side, and in a thread about the longevity of the E53, that is an absolute concern.