anyone else ordered new Passport 9500ci radar detector for their X5?

[FSETH]

Originally Posted by 2Fast455

I will give you an example. Take what you want from this. On 99 corvette that had a k40 laser jammer on it. On the same road with k40 off the distance the car would pick up was 2200 ft @50mph. Now with k40 on it would pick up at 2100ft @ 50mph. So yes the jammer works. I wont dispute that. Bear in mind when car was shot the laser unti gives a tone and showed the code E07 in the scope and on the display. From the K40 information they claim that once the detector detects the laser signal it disperses the beam and resets itself. Supposedly that is why the laser unit is now able to target the vehicle. I think we both agree that is the time to slow down. A vehicle going 50 travels about 75ft per second. Hopefully we both will agree on that. Keep in mind the laser calculates speed and distance in 1/3 of a second. The point I am trying to make is how much speed can you scrub off in 1/3 of a second or even 1 second. This is with a marksman LTI 20/20. back to my personal experience I have yet to ever have a car when targeting not give a speed. I think this is what guysoflidat claim to be jam to gun. I have gotten many E07s followed immediately by a speed/distance reading. Another little fact with the marksman laser is it can continuously track a vehicle by not releasing the trigger. So it can keep providing the speed and distance on a vehicle. It is also will only emit the beam when the trigger is depressed. Hopefully that helps.

Keep in mind this is one example, with one gun, on one car, with one laser jammer, in one location. These results will vary. There are some jammers that work better than others, some guns that are more easily jammed than others as well as varying road conditions and traffic volumes. I am not saying it is an inacurate example, I am just saying that was one particular scenario.

There have been plety of cases where the laser was jammed to gun or the laser was defelcted long enough to let the driver slow down to legal speeds. I never ever said jammers worked everytime, but you have really made it sound like they are a waste and will never work at all to give you sufficient warning, which is not necessarily true.

I will not argue with you any further about Georgia law since I am in NY. It is 100% possible for a conviction alone on a speed estimate.

Agree do disagree, I guess. I am exhausted.

[2Fast455]

Keep in mind this is one example, with one gun, on one car, with one laser jammer, in one location. These results will vary. There are some jammers that work better than others, some guns that are more easily jammed than others as well as varying road conditions and traffic volumes. I am not saying it is an inacurate example, I am just saying that was one particular scenario.

There have been plety of cases where the laser was jammed to gun or the laser was defelcted long enough to let the driver slow down to legal speeds. I never ever said jammers worked everytime, but you have really made it sound like they are a waste and will never work at all to give you sufficient warning, which is not necessarily true.

I can give you many other examples with different vehicles and different jammers. Quite a few people I know have jammers. The only Laser I have used is the marksman LTI. Pretty sure that is the most widely used Laser nation wide. How many tests have you actually witnessed firsthand where the laser was jammed to gun? Not sure where you called me out. Are you asking how many tickets I have written based on just a visual estimate? That answer would be none. I have been certified since the academy. Are you asking me if with certainty I could say a convicton could result in NY based on a speed estimate alone? I would say yes. A laser jammer alone will not give you any warning without being used with a laser detector.

I could have worded this is a more pleasant manner, but I am still waiting for the answer. How many people have you just said "hey, I thnk that guy is speading, let me pull him over without checking his speed and give him a ticket?" That is the way you were making it sound. I read that if a detection device was used in the first place and then thrown out the officers visual estimate may come into play. I would imagine that the biggest cause for a LEO's speed detection reading would be thrown out was officer error or obtaining the reading illegally. Therefore, the chances of the driver fighting this and winning are much higher. Plus, keep in mind that the officer did at one time or another have a reading to cooberate his visual opinion. Without ever having a reading (ex. jammer works long enough for a driver to slow down to the speed limit) the LEO really wouldn't have a case if it were in a state where laser jammers are legal. If you can prove otherwise on this I will back down, but the only law you showed me stated that there was at one point or another a reading on a speed measuring device. The chances of a person getting a speeding ticket from a LEO with ONLY A VISUAL ESTIMATE is pretty freaking unlikely in the first place.

I will try to answer this again for you. I have never "hey i think that guy is speeding let me pull him over for speeding and give him a ticket". The reason being is a cop makes a visual estimate before any use of a laser radar or pace. I can see a ticket getting thrown out without a vehicle speed estimate because there would be no justification for use of laser or radar. I can't tell if you were serious or just using somantics. I never made it sound like such. A speed estimate is required.

Even if the jammer worked to the gun the cop would still have his initial speed estimate. I think this is where we will continue to disagree on. A cop makes a visual estimate before targeting a vehicle with the laser. I am guessing when you went to court one of your tickets cop basically testified he mad a visual estimate of XXmph at XX feet then rceived a laser reading of XXmph at XX feet. I would totally agree if a cop testified to only receiving a laser reading without a speed estimate it would get dismissed. On the flipside if he testified he made a speed estimate and was unable to receive a laser reading I have a hard time believeing it will result in it getting thrown out. We both have different interpetation on that Casey V. State ruling. The way its worded to me seems "you have still established a violation by giving opinion of speed. " with or without a speed reading to cooberate his estimate it is still sufficient for a speeding violation. Not sure how you interpret that.

I would agree the likelyhood would be low to get a ticket on the basis of speed estimate alone if he didnt have a radar or laser but I can see it happening if he has a speed estimate and testifies he attempted to receive a laser reading and recieved a jammed code. I wouldn't want to risk that one as a motorist.

Hopefully I didnt miss anything on this one.

[FSETH]

OK, so to clear all of this up, here are where our opinions differ;

Issue #1

I say that laser jammers can be effective depending on the gun, jammer, installation, traffic conditions, accuracy of LEO with the laser gun, etc. I think that they can actually jam to gun occasionally and that they CAN in some situations give you time to slow down to legal speeds. I also say that there will be times where they work, but not long enough for you to slow down and that there will be times when they do not work at all.

You have expressed that you feel they will never work well enough to even give enough notice to slow down significantly and in most cases wont work at all.

Issue #2

I say a cop will NEVER give you a speeding ticket based on visual evidence alone without EVER having a reading with a detection device.

You say that a cop can issue you a ticket for speeding when the ONLY basis for his assumption is his viusual reading. Keep in mind we are saying that a reading was NEVER obtained with a speed detection device such as a radar or laser gun. You are saying all he has to do is visually look at your car coming down the road with his two eyes and say you were speeding, NOTHING ELSE. Although, in your 15 year career you have never done this.

[2Fast455]

Seems like we are still playing word games with each other so I will give it my best.
Issue #1
If you are going 85 mph and detector goes off with jammer will you have enough time to slow to say 55mph I say No. If you are going 70mph it may give enough time to slow to 55.

Issue #2
Yes I say a cop CAN issue a speeding ticket based on a visual speed estimate. No I haven't issued a speeding ticket on a visual estimate. Finally Yes I believe in NY I could issue a ticket based on a visual speed estimate and subsequent conviction after a trial based soley on a speed estimate.

[2Fast455]

Here is another link. Do a search for visual speed estimates.

http://www.freeadvice.com/search.php...=31&sa.y=9#925

[Fastbuck]

Will you two get a room, you're wasting my electricity!

[FSETH]

Originally Posted by 2Fast455

Here is another link. Do a search for visual speed estimates.

http://www.freeadvice.com/search.php...=31&sa.y=9#925

This was also on that link,

However, the officer can still say he visually estimated the speed, and just used device to confirm it (and not as evidence).
Not sure what you are saying since visual estimate won't stand on its own in PA. (Comm. v Martorano)

so I guess it varies by state and seeing as I have never heard of anyone I personally know in my life getting a ticket this way and you have never issued one in your 15 years of service, I would say the odds of this ever happening are about as small as winning a $million in the lotto.

[FSETH]

Originally Posted by 2Fast455

Seems like we are still playing word games with each other so I will give it my best.
Issue #1
If you are going 85 mph and detector goes off with jammer will you have enough time to slow to say 55mph I say No. If you are going 70mph it may give enough time to slow to 55.

I am trying my best to see where you got confused. After re-reading one of your first posts, it looks like you thought I said you would be invisible to the police with a laser jammer, which is something I NEVER said. So you do agree then, laser jammers can work to help prevent tickets and can actually do what they are designed to do?

Issue #2
Yes I say a cop CAN issue a speeding ticket based on a visual speed estimate. No I haven't issued a speeding ticket on a visual estimate. Finally Yes I believe in NY I could issue a ticket based on a visual speed estimate and subsequent conviction after a trial based soley on a speed estimate.

see my post above for a response to this part.

[Denalio]

Originally Posted by Fastbuck

Will you two get a room, you're wasting my electricity!

YEP!.....

[skarletknite]

cat fight!