New 9/11 film coming out next month - Page 4

B&DCalgary · #31 08-30-2006, 01:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eric5273

I guess all skinny arab guys with beards look the same to you.

Can you not see that the guy in picture E is a totally different guy who looks very little like Osama? Look at his nose and compare to the nose in the other pictures. His head is a different shape.

The other thing I didn't mention is that the Osama in picture E is right handed (he writes with his right hand in the video) while according to the FBI and all other sources, Osama is left handed.

And as far as the pictures, Pictures A-D are pre-9/11, while Picture E is supposedly post-9/11 -- just the opposite of what you suggest.

Here's what a bit of research turns up. Picture E is an isolated frame of the video chosen due to its angle and lighting to look the least like Osama. It also ignores the fact that all his lieutenants are in the same video, and I doubt very much if they would be able to find perfect doubles for each of the motley crew. When you look at the video rather than the single frame capture that has been circulated as evidence that it wasn't Osama in the tape, it's obvious that it's him in the video. The image below is a screen cap from the same video and it's obviously Osama bin Laden in the image, so picking a bad frame from the video and trying to promote it as evidence to the contrary is complete and deliberate misrepresentation.

As far as Osama being left handed, that's still open for conjecture. Nobody really knows for certain. In his culture, however, the right hand is generally used for for writing whenever possible even if a person is left handed. The left hand is reserved for 'dirty' jobs such as wiping one's self, and the right hand is used for eating, writing, etc. More significant, however, is the fact Osama has been videotaped and photographed on previous occasions writing with his right hand (below), so the argument that it can't be him in the video because he's using his right hand simply doesn't hold water.

And now.....

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Eric5273 · #32 08-30-2006, 03:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JV

It is well known that Ziad Jarra, the Lebanese dental student who piloted flight 93 after the midair takeover trained in Al-Qaeda camps in Afghanistan and personally met Osama Bin Laden.

Indeed, Jarra is the only hijacker who had any direct contact with Osama bin Laden. But there are problems with the accounts of Jarra.

I'm not sure if you have ever done any reading on the JFK Assasination, but one of the interesting books out there is called "The Two Oswalds". Basically you had two seperate people named Lee Harvey Oswald, and both were in the Marines at the same time and stationed at the same base. After the JFK Assasination, the records were altered to make the appearance that there was one of them, not two. Parts of both bios were combined to make a single bio. What evidence is there that there were two of him? Well, if you do research, there is lots...

The most obvious ones are that he was in two places at the same time. While he was in Russia, he was also stationed at a Marine base in the United States and reported for duty every day. While he was in New Orleans, he was also in Dallas. Inconsistancies in his childhood school records: medical records show he was of normal height as a child, but childhood friends and teachers interviewed remember him as the shortest kid in the class and say the kids teased him because of this. They say he did not grow to normal height until high school. He spoke fluent Russian, but there are no records of him ever having learned the language. Those are just a few of the things.

What was eventually uncovered is that the other Lee Harvey Oswald was still alive (as of about 15 years ago) and was living in Florida. Both Oswalds were the same age and they both looked very similar -- almost could have passed for twins. The Oswald that was arrested and charged in the JFK assassination and killed by Jack Ruby was not born in the United States as the bio says, but was actually Russian. The Oswald that is (or was) still alive was born in the United States and most of his bio is what appears in the "official" Lee Harvey Oswald bio records.

I'm not in the intelligence business, but people who are have confirmed that one of the things that is somewhat common is two have 2 agents using the same name, and they purposely pick two that look the same. Why? I suppose in the spy business being able to have someone in 2 places at the same time, but have authorities think there is only one of them, is of great use.

Where am I going with this? When I read the following article a couple of years ago, there was some "deja vu".

http://s3.amazonaws.com/911timeline/...sayjarrah.html

BTW, here is a website with the info on "the two oswalds" if you are curious: http://home.wi.rr.com/harveyandlee/

Eric5273 · #33 08-30-2006, 04:01 AM

Your picture:

Osama:

Clearly not the same guy. Somewhat similar features, but not the same guy.

Eric5273 · #34 08-30-2006, 11:24 AM

There are many more problems with this tape:

1. For one thing, in the video Osama is wearing a gold ring on his right hand which does not appear on any other confirmed photos or videos of him. Another man in the video is also seen wearing a large gold ring. The wearing of gold rings is forbidden by Islam

2. On December 27, 2001, a second video containing a pale skinned and Osama (Osama "C" in the above picture) was broadcast on Al-Jazeera. In the tape, bin Laden refers to the U.S. bombing of a mosque in Khost "several days" earlier. The U.S. bombed a mosque in Khost on Nov. 16th. The fake video was dated November 9th, one week earlier. Yet he looks totally different in this "new" video. Gone is the gold ring, his beard is collored differently and trimmed in a different style, etc. Also, in this video he does not claim any responsibility for the 9/11 attacks nor does he even mention them, but he does mention the embassy bombings as Al-Queda's largest attack on America.

3. In the video Bin Laden says on the tape that while the hijackers knew they were on a "martyrdom operation," some did not know anything about the plot until just before they boarded the planes. He also says those who were trained to fly didn't know the others. Yet that contradicts the FBI's claims which have been stated above:

Quote:

In late 1999, according to the 9/11 Commission Report, Jarrah, Mohammed Atta, Marwan al-Shehhi, Said Bahaji, and Ramzi Binalshibh decided to travel to Chechnya to fight against the Russians. They were convinced by Khalid al-Masri and Mohamedou Ould Slahi at the last minute to change their plans, and instead traveled to Afghanistan to meet with Osama bin Laden and train for terrorist attacks. They were told they were on a highly secret mission, and were instructed to return to Germany and enroll in flight school. This account is provided solely from the testimony of captured al-Qaeda member Ramzi Binalshibh. In October of 1999 Ziad Jarrah was filmed at Said Bahaji's wedding with other 9/11 hijackers, including Marwan al-Shehhi.

4. In the video, Osama praises two of the hijackers: Wail M. Alshehri and Salem Alhazmi. The problem is that both of these men have been confirmed to be alive. The FBI has confirmed that some of the hijackers must have used fake IDs. Remember that this video was not recorded for public viewing, but was a private conversation. So then why did Osama not know the real names of the hijackers that he chose?

False Identities Mislead FBI

The FBI acknowledged yesterday that some of the terrorists involved in the attacks last week were using false identities, as it emerged that at least two men had been wrongly implicated.

After analysis of the passenger lists of the four hijacked flights and other immigration documents, investigators identified Salem Al-Hazmi and Abdulaziz Al-Omari as two of the terrorists.

The real Salem Al-Hazmi, however, is alive and indignant in Saudi Arabia, and not one of the people who perished in the American Airlines flight that crashed on the Pentagon. He works at a government-owned petroleum and chemical plant in the city of Yanbu.
He said yesterday he had not left Saudi Arabia for two years, but that his passport had been stolen by a pickpocket in Cairo three years ago.

In fact, a number of these 19 "hijackers" have turned up alive and well:

Hijack 'suspects' alive and well

A number of them were interviewed by the BBC after 9/11. In each and every case, their pictures and bios match the FBI's information 100%, and in each and every case, they had lost or had their IDs stolen in the last several years. What is obvious is that many of the real hijackers were using fake IDs. So then why would Osama not know their real names?

Shortly after these interviews of "living" hijack suspects by the BBC and other media sources, the FBI conceded that indeed some of the hijackers must have been using fake IDs. But several months later, perhaps realizing that this admission throws their whole case up in the air, they released a memo stating that none of the hijackers had used fake IDs. After all, if some of the hijackers were using fake IDs, then it would seem very likely that all of them were. And given this posiblity, the FBI would have to admit that they have no idea who hijacked those planes.

5. When asked why there is no mention of 9/11 on the FBI's Bin Laden Most Wanted web page, Rex Tomb (Chief of Investigative Publicity for the FBI) said, "The reason why 9/11 is not mentioned on Usama Bin Laden’s Most Wanted page is because the FBI has no hard evidence connecting Bin Laden to 9/11." ... The Muckraker Report attempted to secure a reference to the U.S. government authenticating the "Bin Laden confession video", to no avail. However, it is conclusive that the Bush Administration and U.S. Congress, along with the dead stream media, played the video as if it was authentic. So why doesn’t the FBI view the "confession video" as hard evidence? [Muckraker Report]

BMW X5 · #35 08-30-2006, 11:52 AM

you have got serious issues simple as that. you would have probably been right alongside the lawyer who said he would defend aladin over there shall he ever get caught

JV · #36 08-30-2006, 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eric5273

Indeed, Jarra is the only hijacker who had any direct contact with Osama bin Laden. But there are problems with the accounts of Jarra.

I have read a few other reports in addition to the one you posted about Jarra, and it certainly casts doubt on which Jarra was behind the yoke of flight 93. The one thing that still puzzles me is if indeed the Ziad Jarra who was allegedly attending a wedding in Lebanon on 9/22/01 was not on flight 93, what the hell happened to him? No one has seen him or heard from him since 9/11. I think there's more to the story.

JV

Eric5273 · #37 08-30-2006, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JV

I have read a few other reports in addition to the one you posted about Jarra, and it certainly casts doubt on which Jarra was behind the yoke of flight 93. The one thing that still puzzles me is if indeed the Ziad Jarra who was allegedly attending a wedding in Lebanon on 9/22/01 was not on flight 93, what the hell happened to him? No one has seen him or heard from him since 9/11. I think there's more to the story.

Well, you can't exactly have him running around alive if he is to be framed as one of the hijackers. I would guess he would have been murdered. If the people carrying out the attacks did not care about killing 3,000 people, do you think they would lose sleep over one more?

The question you have to ask yourself, is why would one of the hijackers use a fake identitiy of someone who could easily be linked with Osama bin Laden? (it took the FBI less than a week to discover this link) Obviously using such a fake ID would not make it easier to enter the country or to travel -- one would think it could potentially make things more difficult. The only logical reason would be to artificially create a trail of evidence leading to bin Laden after the fact.

There is also another hijacker that also has a similar case of "double identity", but I can't remember who it is at the moment, and I don't feel like looking it up.

Above when I said "please post some evidence implicating Osama", I was trying to provoke some thought. In my own research and reading on 9/11, I have come across quite a bit evidence implicating Al-Queda. But every last bit of that evidence has to do with Al-Queda's ties to ISI chief General Mahmood Ahmed. All of the money transfers through Dubai were run through him and his agents. However, this points the Pakistani government being a "state sponsor" of the 9/11 attacks, and the FBI has avoided this path like the plague.

The best evidence implicating Al-Queda is the evidence that was given to the FBI by Indian intelligence. Read about Ahmed Omar Saeed Sheikh at the link below. This guy was very close with Osama bin Laden, and many in intelligence circles said he was being groomed to be Osama's successor. And yes, this is the same guy who was later convicted in the Daniel Pearl murder:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahmed_Omar_Saeed_Sheikh

Alleged connection to 9/11

On October 6, 2001, a senior-level U.S. government official told CNN that U.S. investigators had discovered Ahmed Omar Saeed Sheikh (Sheik Syed), using the alias "Mustafa Muhammad Ahmad" had sent about $100,000 from the United Arab Emirates to Mohammed Atta. "Investigators said Atta then distributed the funds to conspirators in Florida in the weeks before the deadliest acts of terrorism on U.S. soil that destroyed the World Trade Center, heavily damaged the Pentagon and left thousands dead. In addition, sources have said Atta sent thousands of dollars -- believed to be excess funds from the operation -- back to Saeed in the United Arab Emirates in the days before September 11. CNN later confirmed this.

The 9/11 Commission's Final Report states that the source of the funds "remains unknown."

More than a month after the money transfer was discovered, the head of ISI, General Mehmood Ahmed resigned from his position. Indian news outlets reported the FBI was investigating the possibility that Gen. Ahmed ordered Saeed Sheikh to send the $100,000 to Atta, while most Western media outlets only reported his connections to the Taliban as the reason for his departure.

The Wall Street Journal was one of the only Western news organizations to follow up on the story, citing the Times of India: "US authorities sought [Gen. Mehmood Ahmed's] removal after confirming the fact that $100,000 [was] wired to WTC hijacker Mohammed Atta from Pakistan by Ahmad Umar Sheikh at the instance of Gen Mehmood." Another Indian newspaper, the Daily Excelsior, quoting FBI sources, reported that the "FBI’s examination of the hard disk of the cellphone company Omar Sheikh had subscribed to led to the discovery of the "link" between him and the deposed chief of the Pakistani ISI, Gen. Mehmood Ahmed. And as the FBI investigators delved deep, sensational reports surfaced with regard to the transfer of 100,000 dollars to Mohammed Atta, one of the kamikaze pilots who flew his Boeing into the World Trade Centre. Gen. Mehmood Ahmed, the FBI investigators found, fully knew about the transfer of money to Atta."

The Pittsburgh Tribune notes that "There are many in Musharraf's government who believe that Saeed Sheikh's power comes not from the ISI, but from his connections with our own CIA."

Sheikh rose to prominence with the 2002 killing of Wall Street Journal reporter Daniel Pearl, who at the time was in Pakistan investigating connnections between the ISI and Islamic militant groups. In Pakistan, Sheikh was sentenced to death for killing Pearl, however his complicity in the execution and the reasons behind it are in dispute.

A Wall Street Journal review of Bernard-Henri Levy's book “Who Killed Daniel Pearl?” notes, “It is a fact that Gen. Mehmood Ahmed, then head of the ISI, wired $100,000 to Mohamed Atta before 9/11 through an intermediary."

A couple interesting points about this:

1. General Ahmed and General Musharraf were very close. Both attended college together, and were friends for decades. When the Musharraf seized power in a 1998 coup, he appointed General Ahmed as head of the ISI. I cannot imagine that Musharraf did not know about the money transfers and the 9/11 plot.

2. http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp...nguage=printer

On the morning of Sept. 11, Goss and Graham were having breakfast with a Pakistani general named Mahmud Ahmed -- the soon-to-be-sacked head of Pakistan's intelligence service. Ahmed ran a spy agency notoriously close to Osama bin Laden and the Taliban.

It's no big mystery why the 9/11 Commission chose not to follow this path of investigation...

Lambeau · #38 08-30-2006, 03:19 PM

Eric,
You are so far out there that you must be the laughing stock of this site. I might be a backwoods, gun-toting veteran but I'm thinking i'm not viewed as the wackiest poster here. Do you do this just for attention? just give it up, nobody else believes what you post anyway. It's beyond fun anymore.

6to · #39 08-30-2006, 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JV

What are you flying around in there in the avatar? A-star?

JV

Robinson R-44. A bit smaller & lighter than the A-Star; 4-seater.

6to · #40 08-30-2006, 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asawadude

Take the most distorted screen capture from an already distorted home video and say that is it unrefutable proof that the man in the video is an imposter.

And you were doing so well, Eric...

Inspite of the fact that it's very low-res and distorted, it really looks to me like it's definitely not bin-laden.

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