What is with Obama?

[E61Silver]

Originally Posted by Quicksilver

Yep, Obama gets the blame again.......

You could see a direct impact from Obama's comment on Bank stocks.

Right now he is focused on Health Care and is leaving the Banks alone.

Hopefully he will get some form of health care reform passed.

[dsm2925]

Originally Posted by petener999

LOL...

[dsm2925]

i rather have Obama as instead of Bush. Maybe Palin will be better next term?

[GoVols!]

Here is what I don't get and maybe this forum is a good place to ask. I understand why a majority of Obama's base wants this healthcare "reform" and that is because they think they will get something for nothing, paid for by the evil rich.

Now, since this is a BMW board, I would venture a guess that Obama and his base consider us all the "evil rich". My questions are: Why do those of you on here, who are by and large going to be footing the bill for this, support such "reform"? Why do you want to give away your hard earned money to pay someone else's bills? Is it guilt or something? If so, why don't those with means that feel guilty just donate to a hospital to help those with no money pay instead of trying to force all of us into mandatory charity??

[JCL]

Originally Posted by GoVols!

Here is what I don't get and maybe this forum is a good place to ask. I understand why a majority of Obama's base wants this healthcare "reform" and that is because they think they will get something for nothing, paid for by the evil rich.

Now, since this is a BMW board, I would venture a guess that Obama and his base consider us all the "evil rich". My questions are: Why do those of you on here, who are by and large going to be footing the bill for this, support such "reform"? Why do you want to give away your hard earned money to pay someone else's bills? Is it guilt or something? If so, why don't those with means that feel guilty just donate to a hospital to help those with no money pay instead of trying to force all of us into mandatory charity??

So if I understand your position:

• Only those who are in Obama's camp want any healthcare reform
• People who want healthcare reform all want something for nothing, personally.
• The rich are all evil
• People who own BMWs, and those who post here, are the evil rich
• People who own BMWs will have to give away their hard-earned money to pay someone else's bills

Perhaps some of those who believe in healthcare reform just think that it is wrong to spend the most of any country on health care, with a very high percentage of GDP spent on health care, with such low performance from that system. The US is the only wealthy industrialized nation without universal access to health care. Yet you spend all this money on health care. So, there is interest in reform. There is a debate over the right to health care. And you bring it down to the evil rich? How is that going to advance the debate?

You are being gouged by your health insurance providers who are in it for profit, as they were set up to be. You have great doctors, and great technology, and great inventions, but you don't have great access or great efficiency. How about using some of that innovation to figure out how to serve more people for less money, instead of assuming that it is simply a cash grab.

Just a view from the cheap seats.

[GoVols!]

A couple of your assumptions about my view are incorrect. I don't think rich people are evil, that BMW owners are necessarily rich, or that we don't have access to HC. The sarcasim in my post was laid on pretty thick. My post was pointing out that the by and large way of paying for reform has been "soak the rich" meaning that the general view of those that support the bill is that rich folks(ie. those with money) are going to pay for those that have no money. Since we own BMW's, the vast majority of Obama's base would consider us to be the "evil rich that we can soak" since we actually have nice vehicles, whether or not that is true.

I'm not against all reform, but the current monstrosity does nothing to lower cost. It only shifts cost from one group of people to another and will eventually lead to us all being on European style healthcare that will bankrupt us.

Basically, it comes down to why do you believe that you have the right to someone else's labor(healthcare) or why do believe you have the right to make someone else pay for your needs?

[JCL]

Originally Posted by GoVols!

I'm not against all reform, but the current monstrosity does nothing to lower cost. It only shifts cost from one group of people to another and will eventually lead to us all being on European style healthcare that will bankrupt us.

Basically, it comes down to why do you believe that you have the right to someone else's labor(healthcare) or why do believe you have the right to make someone else pay for your needs?

You have nothing to fear. You are already bankrupt, and those nations that have single payer healthcare (which I didn't think was what your bill proposed, only universal insurance) are generally doing better financially. Linking healthcare to national bankruptcy isn't logical.

Not sure about the right to someone else's labour. Do the shareholders of the HMOs have the right to profit by denying coverage to their customers? Seems that you can spin that one either way.

[Quicksilver]

Ever heard of taxes? Medicare tax? State tax? Local taxes?
Each and every one of these pays for someone else's needs.

Originally Posted by GoVols!

Basically, it comes down to why do you believe that you have the right to someone else's labor(healthcare) or why do believe you have the right to make someone else pay for your needs?

[Quicksilver]

Your reasoning can best be described as silly logic.......
I own a BMW. wait a minute as a matter
of fact I own 2 BMW's. Rich am I?
Don't make me laugh........ Retired bum is more like it)

And I'm positive there are a few people on
public assistance who have better BMW's
than I do. Now that's what you call "evil rich".......

Originally Posted by GoVols!

My post was pointing out that the by and large way of paying for reform has been "soak the rich" meaning that the general view of those that support the bill is that rich folks(ie. those with money) are going to pay for those that have no money. Since we own BMW's, the vast majority of Obama's base would consider us to be the "evil rich that we can soak" since we actually have nice vehicles, whether or not that is true.

[GoVols!]

Originally Posted by Quicksilver

Ever heard of taxes? Medicare tax? State tax? Local taxes?
Each and every one of these pays for someone else's needs.

True, but that doesn't make it right. Taxes are meant to be used to run the basic operations of the government(defense and commerce), not to provide for everyone's needs.