^Thank you. That is a much more explained response of which I certainly relate to and empathize with much more. Not that you owe me an explanation as you don't know me from Adam, but for the sake of the discussion we have been having, it definitely helps.

1. Silencers - I don't put much weight into the reasons for a silencer you posed. Home defense... your kids are likely to hear to louder from a low flying plane, unless you have to fire the weapon off right next to their head. Here, all the ranges I have access to are indoor and I honestly can't even hear weapons from outside the building. For firing a bunch, just wear ear protection... you wouldn't try to find a silencer for a grinder or table saw. Accuracy... I can't speak to that as I've never fired a weapon with a silencer.

As for a reason against silencers... it makes it easier to hide a crime.

2. Transfers - That sucks. That law seems designed as an encumbrance and money maker for the local municipalities. You live in a liberal state, I can only empathize with you and wish you the best of luck.

3. Lobbying - I was not saying only the right spends money. I was posing that there is too much money influencing politics. I could see how it could come off skewed as I did mention the NRA specifically.

Try using a silencer sometime. You will find that they definitely are not "silent". Most of what people know about them comes from Hollywood which is completely inaccurate. Much like Steve McQueen's Bullitt car didn't have 32 gears to upshift into. ;)

If someone wants to hide a crime by making their gun quieter, they'll use a water bottle, potato, or pipe with freeze plugs. A real suppressor is $500-$1000. No criminal is going to go buy one at that price.


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And I believe all of that (except the Bullitt part, that mustang most certainly had 32 gears :D), as you're right, I have no experience with them whatsoever.

That said, I still don't believe there is a logical reason to own one either, except as a hobbyist just to have one. :dunno:

I think your hardline stance stems from your negative experiences with trying to enjoy your hobby in your particular state. Which I can certainly understand, just not necessarily agree with. I want people to enjoy their guns and feel safe being able to carry them, which they can do with conceal carry. I just don't want their carrying openly to infringe on the rights of others (and mine). It's akin to someone walking around naked. Am I particularly offended by that, no, but I can understand why there are laws against it.

Like anything enjoyable the government (state and federal) wants their slice of the pie, or cake as in your satirical cartoon. Until recently I had to pay 5 registrations, 5 inspections, and full price insurance on 5 (even though we only have 2 drivers in the house) cars because my wife and I enjoy that hobby. Was I happy about it, definitely not.

LOL man, imagine how tires his right arm and left foot must have been after shooting that movie!

That's the thing... there isn't a law against it. In most states, including yours and mine, open carry is perfectly legal.

There's a good map here: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open..._United_States



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I only came in to post in agreement with Eric that Bloombergs "gun safety" group outspends the NRA in lobbying and campaigning in toss up states to chip away (Washington great example) - the actual 2A preservation crowd is outspent easily every election cycle, it's not even close.

Yes as a pseudo (I'm not for open borders) libertarian I believe in the 10th amendment which says the powers NOT delegated to the federal government are reserved to the states or to the people. I believe that this "well my state interprets the 2nd amendment differently" is a lot of BS. Look at poor New York. 95% of the state is vast rural up to Canada but Albany and NYC dictate the whole state. Surprisingly enough you can actually get a carry permit in NYS in the rural counties. But unless you are Schumer or Bloomberg himself (they have unrestricted carry permits) you would be a felon bringing it into the city. How well is the 1st Amendment regulated on the state level? Gay marriage is the "law of the land" yet not found in the Bill of Rights. Yet "the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed" is a hard enough sentence that needs 50 different types of interpretation? It's about control, and nothing else. .

Joseph I for one would not want to use a table saw or an angle grinder without ear protection. Making suppressors available for the public will not enable all these law abiding owners to suddenly just wake up and say "now crime is so easy I need to go commit one"

Coming from construction I will tell you that the sharpness of gunshots is a lot rougher on your ears than using machinery but I sure would not want to do either without hearing protection, unfortunately in a self defense scenario out in public you would need to go without, but it would be nice to have the option for some of your home defense firearms.

I actually was going to to buy a VP9 With threaded barrel just to have in case the day comes when the HPA passes.

Good thread ongoing, as usual...
RB/J: Congrats on your upcoming departure from NJ and your heading to NC! :)
GL, mD

I hear you, and I wasn't necessarily arguing the current legality of open carry. More so the consideration for the other patrons of an establishment who aren't as comfortable with firearms as you might be. It doesn't hurt to just cover up the weapon.

And I can definitely believe that in his particular state of residence. There are lots of other places where the right outspends the left considerably. On many different issues. It's one of the reasons I believe money should not be a motivator in a political system... once Citizens United (what a name, has much less to do with Citizens and much more to do with special interests and corporations) passed everything started going down hill, and will continue to do so.

I hear you, and don't necessarily disagree with any of the above. I've always believed (well since being old enough to care about how our country runs) that the law should apply equally to our politicians/law makers. But it doesn't... and now that we have unlimited money pouring in from everywhere into our election processes that isn't likely to change anytime soon because it is so hard to get anyone out of office. WHY DO WE NOT HAVE TERM LIMITS??? Aaaarrrrgg. Oh, sorry... #triggered

LOL, I wasn't trying to say that suddenly law-abiding citizens would go out and commit crime. I couldn't think of a "good" reason not to allow silencers, just as I didn't believe there was any good reason to allow silencers. I'm pretty ambivalent about silencer legality as, for me, it's just another accessory for a weapon.

Oh, and again, the right has the best methods of naming their committees, coalitions, and legislature... "Hearing Protection Act." :rofl: Almost as good as CU.

So, I understand the gun enthusiasts plight (I am obviously not an enthusiast in firearms but am in other hobbies) and can understand the desire for firearms (and accessories) to be open, free, and available to like-minded individuals. But no matter how you slice it, guns are dangerous, and there will be a certain amount of legislation that goes along with that hobby. :dunno: Unfortunately in yours and Gregg's particular cases the pendulum has swung so far the other direction that it borders on making criminals out of hobbyists/enthusiasts as you have outlined. Is that unfair? Hell yes! Do we need to abolish all gun legislation and have 2A be completely unregulated? No.

I have guns here for protection, and that's it. I'm a decent shot, but do I go practice... no. Do I display my guns because I enjoy them... no. I'm the prius driver of gun ownership as they are just something that gets the job done for me. Which is funny because my dad says at least one of them is a pretty nice classic rifle. :dunno: To me, that one would just put a big hole (largest caliber gun I have) in someone that was trying to break into my house or car. Nothing more. But I still support those who do enjoy them, as you guys do, in their right to be able to enjoy their chosen money suck. Like I do with BMW's or electronics. All I'm asking is to pull a shirt over your gun when going into a place where families and kids are... ;)

I do enjoy coming in here though and viewing all the firearm pron you guys post. :thumbup: Even if I have no idea what you are talking about most of the time.

Good chat Joseph :thumbup: No one can agree with someone on everything and glad to see we have some super common ground on our views of how the government is run. In the meantime, go do some shooting, do some research on the firearms you own, and enjoy - we are obviously here to bounce ideas on purchases, best defense firearms, etc -

One thing I can say for myself, Eric, etc here and all the other enthusiasts I know is that we want to TEACH people who may not know much about firearms, are confused about things - We are usually the most open about discussing our hobby, and educating people who may be new to it. This is how we keep the 2A alive, and in my opinion, ESPECIALLY getting new WOMEN shooters enthusiastic, trained, and into the sport -

Bloomberg pushing a big anti-women campaign now, something to the likes of "you don't need a gun to be tough", celebrities saying how scared they are of firearms (social mind-fucking by influence), etc etc - but yes I believe the youth, and women are the key to the next generation to keep it alive.

Thus why I am ecstatic for my wife to get her first pistol that's actually hers, I don't care how girly it is, I've said it before, if "boring black guns" make her not want to shoot but something hot pink does, then I'll buy her hot pink all day long.

Took the CCW class and submitted all my paperwork on the 18th. Should have my permit in about 2 weeks!

Deciding between P320 Carry or Beretta 92FS Compact. Can't carry my current 226, might be looking to off load it

My $.02 is the Sig 320 between those two choices.


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