Just ordered BMW X5 35d

[Lubehead]

tcfila... I think the list is $1200 or something stupid like that. I paid $800 on the '08 and when I negotiated for this one, I just put down $800 and no one questioned it. Should have said 5 or 6 maybe!

[MINIz guy]

Originally Posted by jaaX3

Look at the page here that says "Wholesale Confidential": Xoutpost.com - View Single Post - 2010 X5: Pricing, Anniversary edition and other new stuff

Is "Confidential Wholesale Price" the same as invoice?

If so, then we are actually paying $2395 over invoice and not $1000 over invoice. Did Paul Miller BMW lie to us?

[tim-atl]

Originally Posted by MINz guy

If so, then we are actually paying $2395 over invoice and not $1000 over invoice. Did Paul Miller BMW lie to us?

That's rhetorical right?

make sure you are drawing the line in the right place on your invoice. $1000 over invoice won't include things like MACO, Training Fee, Documentation fee's, taxes, etc...

Tim

[MINIz guy]

Our $1000 over invoice did not include any other fees, just the car and the options.

Now I feel stupid not making this connection, and not looking more carefully at what LeMansX5 had posted.

Edit: Invoice also included destination... whoops!

[kbp33]

Originally Posted by tim-atl

That's rhetorical right?

make sure you are drawing the line in the right place on your invoice. $1000 over invoice won't include things like MACO, Training Fee, Documentation fee's, taxes, etc...

Tim

Just curious, how much are MACO, Training fees? I was charged $200 for documentation.

[tim-atl]

Found this via google, dated 12/2008:

Ours (Park Ave BMW in NJ) is as follows:

Doc: $249
MACO: $300
training: $180

[jaaX3]

Doc fees are 100% dealer profit. I would try to negotiate them into the price of the car (i.e. if you got $1k over invoice, make sure that includes doc fees). My dealer charges $399 for their doc fee.
MACO in my area is $300 (it's not the same everywhere you go).
Training is $180.

[Penguin]

Originally Posted by jaaX3

I would try to negotiate them into the price of the car (i.e. if you got $1k over invoice, make sure that includes doc fees). Training is $180.

I would agree. The MACO and Training fees are real variable costs to the dealer and considered by most dealers to be part of the invoice price, i.e., the dealer actually pays the MACO and Training amounts to BMW NA for every vehicle they sell, and when they quote "$1,000 over invoice," that typically means the wholesale price you find on the internet plus the $500 of MACO and training fees.

One can debate forever whether or not those MACO and Training fees should be considered part of the invoice price, to which the negotiated "profit" amount will be added, but all that really matters is to get the final "price out the door" quote when finalizing the deal, e.g., if one dealer says "$500 over invoice," but includes the MACO and Training fees as part of the invoice, it's the same as another dealer quoting "$1,000 over invoice," if they do not include the MACO and Training fees as part of the invoice price.

I do believe that if you ask the dealer to pull-out ans show you the invoice from BMW NA after the car arrives, it will show MACO and Training fees added to the "wholesale" price.

[brocks]

Originally Posted by brocks

I just got a call back from my salesman stating that the regional sales rep said I should have a production number this week There just weren't enough numbers available when I ordered.

Also he told me that the $4500 eco-credit is being extended through October!

I just called my rep and I now have a production number
Everything is correct on BMW's tracking site, of course it's in 111 Status...Now I'm less nervous and much more excited!!

[DSE]

My consolation for (finally) getting my price down to a so-so $1875 above invoice was making clear (in writing) that I was not paying any other charges or fees over my final price other than tax, title and license (no training fees, MACO fees, etc.). You can argue with a dealer until you're blue in the face about whether it is appropriate to charge these fees to customers -- even if they are really incurred by the dealer, but ultimately it is about bottom line comparisons, so other dealers who wanted to charge these fees had to offer a significantly lower price if tehye wanted to charge thee fees.