Military/War discussion - Page 11

BMW X5 · #**101** 09-21-2006, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by burkleymh

On another note, history lesson - during the Renaissance, Swiss troops were the meanest mothers in the valley, plus the original "sorched earth" policy - it's that reputation that allowed Switzerland to be neutral through 2 world wars - The training to become a Papal Swiss Guard is one of the toughest in the world - there is not an elite soldier around the world that does not respect them

Mark thank you for the explanation here I thought I was loosing my mind

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Eric5273 · #**102** 09-21-2006, 12:13 PM

In my experience, they only get bids from companies that can do the job and are qualified. Not just any company is allowed to submit a bid for any project. The bids are on a request basis. So then they choose the lowest bid from that select group.

What bothers me is that nobody here seems to believe that all the money being spent on war and the large profits being made contribute to war-time decisions. I'm not saying that this is the only reason that politicians decide to go to war, but it does contribute to the decision making process.

I'm sure everyone here knows about Eisenhower's farewell address and his warning about the "Military Industrial Complex". He was not an idiot. His warning was based on his own experiences and its obvious that he himself was presured and perhaps influenced by this lobby or else he would not have given his warning.

If there was suddenly peace throughout the world, these military contracters would lose billions of dollars, and they are not about to let that happen.

I guess my view of the world is vastly different than most on this board. When I see the struggle of "us against them", I don't see "us" as Americans, and "them" as the "communists" or "terrorists". I see "us" as the good common people of the world, and "them" as the powerful elite who control the world at the expense of the common people.

xxx · #**103** 09-21-2006, 10:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eric5273

Well, your impression could very well be wrong. Read this article. It's long but a very interesting read.

(And BTW, just reading the first few paragraphs will not be enough to convince you. But if you read the whole thing, you will be convinced)

http://www.rollingstone.com/news/sto...lection_stolen

That just proves my point. My question is why aren't heads flying over this injustice? Whets the point of having an election when its manipulated? All nations have their problems but this is ridicules. "Land of the free and home of the brave" Is that just a sales pitch? It seems more like "Land of the manipulated and home of the brain washed" America is supposed to be the best nation in the world. One that others should look up to. Then again that might just be an American perspective.

Eric5273 · #**104** 09-21-2006, 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xxx

That just proves my point. My question is why aren't heads flying over this injustice?

Most people don't know about it. Most people are aware of allegations of election fraud, but they do not know the specifics and think it's just a big conspiracy theory that a bunch of leftists have created. That's why I said to read the entire article. If you just read the first few paragraphs, you can come away thinking just that. But if you read the entire article, you will come away convinced.

inlacal · #**105** 09-22-2006, 01:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by burkleymh

There are many good points discussed here - Let me say, I may not agree with all that's been said, but I'll defend to my death your right to say it - open discussion and equally divided opinions define a democracy

My only complaint is the "lie" label to the Iraq war - Before the war, intelligence from Russia, Germany, France, and Egypt all said Saddam had WMDs - history shows he had used them against Iran and the Iraqi Kurds - While the UN inspectors had said they could not find any in Iraq before the war, who honestly believed the UN could actually be right for the 1st time - After Clinton, our own intelligence services were decimated and we had to rely on other nations for information about Iraq - It's very easy to second guess decisions with 20-20 hindsight - But to say the war was based upon a deliberate lie, is the heigth of arrogance - it makes a nice sound bite - but is nothing but a lie itself - those that wish to believe it, only do so by ignoring all that was known before the war - history shows us how difficult it is to make decisions based on "intelligence", which contains both good and bad info - only looking back can you tell which was good and which was bad - But decisions have to be made - Carter showed us what happens when decisions aren't made - world events(and other leaders) lead us around by the nose - Mind you, I think Carter is a nice man, but he sucked as President - The media had nothing nice to say about Reagan,his actions and policies - likewise Bush - they both understand a bully only fears a clenched fist backed by the willinghess to use it - diplomacy only works if BOTH SIDES are willing to compromise - talking does not work against someone who only wishes to kill you

Read the news - These "Islamic radicals" have bluntly stated there can only be one religion and they will kill all others who don't believe as they do - Is this a "lie"? - There is a war out there and alot of the world refuses to see it - and personally, I'd rather fight it somewhere else than my backyard

On another note, history lesson - during the Renaissance, Swiss troops were the meanest mothers in the valley, plus the original "sorched earth" policy - it's that reputation that allowed Switzerland to be neutral through 2 world wars - The training to become a Papal Swiss Guard is one of the toughest in the world - there is not an elite soldier around the world that does not respect them

Elite troops are defined by their individuals, both leaders and soldiers - no nation has a monopoly - training, pride, and "seeing the elephant" (ie battle tested, reference to ancient times, standing your ground in face of this terrifying huge "weapon", Rome vs Carthage, Alexander vs Persia) help make armies, but it is the actions of individuals that raise units to elite or legendary - You have only to look at history to see how so many battles were won or lost by the actions of one or just a few

Wellington said after Waterloo (paraphrased) "It's a good thing war is so terrible, lest we grow too fond of it" - The last thing Bush or Blair want to to is send our sons and daugthers into harm's way, but we are fighting an enemy who glories in death to unbelievers and infidels (and their own) - until the Islamic religious leaders condemn the taking of innocent lives ( is that not against the teachings of Islam? ), terrorism will be the dominant threat throughout the world

To those that say Bush "created" more terrorists, I say you probably think turning on the light "creates" roaches.

If you are against how things are being done, what are your solutions? Running away, means we only delay the battle to a ground the enemy chooses. (NOT good) For all the complaining I hear, I don't hear any solution that is not already being attempted (other than running away)

WAKE UP! they want us dead and have repeatedly told us so. Another "lie"? I prefer Patton's order to "let the other poor dumb bastard die for his country", in this case , religion.

Burk...I usually go to great lengths to say a lot of this. Thanks for evangelizing for me. Epic post. C

Chris

Lambeau · #**106** 09-22-2006, 03:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scottie

The best millitary is this British we are the most feared.

Compared to the Navy Seals and other US special forces? I don't think so. US soldiers are better trained, better equipped with more experience and so on. You are basing your statement on what???

I've worked with other countries soldiers through 2 different wars, have you scottie?

jwilburn · #**107** 09-22-2006, 03:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lambeau

Compared to the Navy Seals and other US special forces? I don't think so. US soldiers are better trained, better equipped with more experience and so on. You are basing your statement on what???

I've worked with other countries soldiers through 2 different wars, have you scottie?

Yup Navy Seals rule by far!