RE: X5 Unrelated, but Good Information in Times of Need

crystalworks · #1 05-21-2020, 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bcredliner

I don't understand why the world would ever be in the need of a pandemic that kills people around the world.

Perhaps the next administration will increase the CDC budget instead of reducing it, expand the task force instead of disbanding it, increase the funding of the WHO to better monitor what will emerge or the next administration will respond with a great preparation plan addressing the CDC, WHO, and Bill Gates warning all put forth years ago.

All of those reasons above might be a few reasons the world needs a pandemic. A reminder about how things come and go a few times a generation that we aren't necessarily prepared for. Ever. This one will pass, nothing will change, and we'll be having this discussion again in 20-30 years. Hopefully a Democrat is in office so the Republican voters can have their turn blaming the opposing administration.

People dying from natural causes, or phenomena doesn't bother me in the way it does some. I'm not of the mind we can save all people all of the time. As Andrew has put it, in no uncertain terms, we are not seeing deaths on a level beyond what we might see from the flu. And that's with most deaths being attributed to CV19. For varying reasons, the numbers being collected are wildly inaccurate (including attributing flu deaths to CV19).

We are not in a black plague-like situation, and talking about it like we are is not going to help the situation. Obviously, I don't wish anyone's grandparent, parent, or themselves to die. OBVIOUSLY. But, if elderly people are always more susceptible to the flu, and we don't freak out that the majority of flu deaths every year are in that population, why are we doing so now? Just like every flu season, the elderly need to be cautious, hygienic, and get the flu vaccine. The rest of us can wear masks, wash hands, etc to help the situation and protect them as much as possible.

Andrew. Even at only 30% effective for the flu vaccine, that's a large statistic. Yes, sometimes it's ineffective because the wrong strain is targeted, but the statistics still show it's better for the public (especially elderly and young children) to get the shot over time.

bcredliner · #2 05-21-2020, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crystalworks

All of those reasons above might be a few reasons the world needs a pandemic. A reminder about how things come and go a few times a generation that we aren't necessarily prepared for. Ever. This one will pass, nothing will change, and we'll be having this discussion again in 20-30 years. Hopefully a Democrat is in office so the Republican voters can have their turn blaming the opposing administration.

People dying from natural causes, or phenomena doesn't bother me in the way it does some. I'm not of the mind we can save all people all of the time. As Andrew has put it, in no uncertain terms, we are not seeing deaths on a level beyond what we might see from the flu. And that's with most deaths being attributed to CV19. For varying reasons, the numbers being collected are wildly inaccurate (including attributing flu deaths to CV19).

We are not in a black plague-like situation, and talking about it like we are is not going to help the situation. Obviously, I don't wish anyone's grandparent, parent, or themselves to die. OBVIOUSLY. But, if elderly people are always more susceptible to the flu, and we don't freak out that the majority of flu deaths every year are in that population, why are we doing so now? Just like every flu season, the elderly need to be cautious, hygienic, and get the flu vaccine. The rest of us can wear masks, wash hands, etc to help the situation and protect them as much as possible.

Andrew. Even at only 30% effective for the flu vaccine, that's a large statistic. Yes, sometimes it's ineffective because the wrong strain is targeted, but the statistics still show it's better for the public (especially elderly and young children) to get the shot over time.

I respect your opinion that a pandemic is needed from time to time but don't share that with you. If nothing happens when we have a pandemic doesn't seem like a reminder is needed, but whatever.

I think it is premature to conclude deaths are similar to that of the flu since people are still dying. If the Covid 19 count is overstated are we sure the flu count isn't also?

I'm sure some folks are freaking out but I don't see anyone doing that here nor anyone acting like it is the Black Plague. Are you referring to someone here?

Important differences between the flu and the Covid 19 virus is we have a treatment regime and a vaccine that at least somewhat effective each year so we have some control over the flu. We aren't there with Covid 19. Another difference is the permanent damage they are now finding in organs from blood clots that may be also happening in cases where all ages, that recover may have.

crystalworks · #3 05-22-2020, 12:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bcredliner

I respect your opinion that a pandemic is needed from time to time but don't share that with you. If nothing happens when we have a pandemic doesn't seem like a reminder is needed, but whatever.

Nobody wants the reminder. I certainly don't want there to be pandemics. It's more a reminder on a personal level of how really small and not in control of everything we all are (including our self-important government). How quickly things can change. I've spent more time with my parents and enjoyed watching them with my kids more now than ever before. It's nice to get the reminder that life is finite and to enjoy those you love for as long as you can. They seem to appreciate it more as well.

I don't think things will change on a national level, except maybe going to war with China (or someone else) once more information is gathered about its origination. But I hope I'm wrong on both counts.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bcredliner

I think it is premature to conclude deaths are similar to that of the flu since people are still dying. If the Covid 19 count is overstated are we sure the flu count isn't also?

I'm sure some folks are freaking out but I don't see anyone doing that here nor anyone acting like it is the Black Plague. Are you referring to someone here?

No, I was referring to the media and certain politicians. They love to report on the most sensational, least rational, and greatest money generating points of view they can find.

Valid point. There are definitely differences between the seasonal flu and cov19. But there are similarities as well. The quote below from health.com shows how many people die (estimated) of flu each year according to the CDC and there is a range associated with the numbers as well, they are giving the estmate, while the CDC's website shows the whole range.

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/past-seasons.html

Quote:

Overall, the CDC estimates that 12,000 and 61,000 deaths annually since 2010 can be blamed on the flu. Globally, the World Health Organization (WHO) estimates that the flu kills 290,000 to 650,000 people per year.

I definitely think the number for cov-19 will be higher than the seasonal flu, for reasons you mentioned (no vaccine, treatments). But it is not going to be catastrophic. As Andrew pointed out, it disproportionately affects the elderly just like the flu. Especially those with pre-existing conditions. If there has to be a silver lining, it looks like cov-19 might be less deadly to children than the flu.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bcredliner

Important differences between the flu and the Covid 19 virus is we have a treatment regime and a vaccine that at least somewhat effective each year so we have some control over the flu. We aren't there with Covid 19. Another difference is the permanent damage they are now finding in organs from blood clots that may be also happening in cases where all ages, that recover may have.

All valid points. We are still learning about this. But don't let the "permanent damage" fear take hold yet. It could be true, we don't know. It's only been a few months. And it might only be in like .05% of cases if there is permanent damage... or it could be in 10% of cases. We don't know.

But as someone who has had walking pneumonia for a year without knowing (I have really large lungs and it took that long to progress and fill up with fluid enough to affect my breathing) and developed scar tissue in my lungs. With therapy and exercise, it does heal. My last set of films showed my lungs nice and clear again and I no longer wheeze on deep breaths. Smokers are also able to clear their lungs from years of damage after they quit. My sister was a lifelong smoker and would hack and gag all the time. She quit about a year ago, sounds like a totally different person.

^Now that above paragraph is unrelated to cov-19 per se, but the human body can repair itself to an amazing degree.

Happy · #4 05-22-2020, 01:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crystalworks

I don't think things will change on a national level, except maybe going to war with China (or someone else) once more information is gathered about its origination. But I hope I'm wrong on both counts.

I pray there is no war. But I want answers!

Quote:

If there has to be a silver lining, it looks like cov-19 might be less deadly to children than the flu.

That has not been my experience. If for any reason your kids fall ill, keep them hydrated, give them vitamins and proper nutrition. Do not hesitate to take them to the pediatrics unit.

Quote:

We are still learning about this. But don't let the "permanent damage" fear take hold yet. It could be true, we don't know. It's only been a few months. And it might only be in like .05% of cases if there is permanent damage... or it could be in 10% of cases. We don't know.

The human body is an amazing creation! It will heal. So far I haven’t seen permanent damage from the virus. We’re all moving about without any handicap, but I think it takes months to fully recover. I believe minor symptoms are still affecting us to this day. The symptoms are all consistent amongst all family members.

Quote:

But as someone who has had walking pneumonia for a year without knowing (I have really large lungs and it took that long to progress and fill up with fluid enough to affect my breathing) and developed scar tissue in my lungs. With therapy and exercise, it does heal. My last set of films showed my lungs nice and clear again and I no longer wheeze on deep breaths. Smokers are also able to clear their lungs from years of damage after they quit. My sister was a lifelong smoker and would hack and gag all the time. She quit about a year ago, sounds like a totally different person.

^Now that above paragraph is unrelated to cov-19 per se, but the human body can repair itself to an amazing degree.

It is my interpretation that this virus gets in your nose or mouth. Then travels to your throat and lungs. It normally stops there with the common cold or flu, but here is where covid19 shines. Once it gets into your lungs, then it gets in your blood stream. Once in the blood stream, then it attacks your organs. For me I stay super hydrated, so kidneys were not greatly affected. However for me, my heart took a beating. It was like nothing I’ve ever experienced before. Blood pressure readings that were ridiculously high. Heart palpitations, shortness of breath, etc. My wife thought on a few occasions, that I was going to go into cardiac arrest in my sleep. She stated to me at one point my heart looked as if it were going to pop out of my chest. This went on for weeks. It also attacked my Gastrointestinal system. I never really suffered vomiting, but the other end, I’ll leave it there. This is still going on.

Never in my life have I been affected by any illness like this. But getting back to permanent damage. I live on 3/4’s of an acre, and I do all my own maintenance. I am pretty much back to full health. Here and there my gut acts up, but so far it’s the only symptom. My heart slightly reminds me it went through trauma, but so far the last 10 days have been ok.

Our bodies will heal if we stay hydrated, eat a proper diet, and take vitamins. And also, abstain from things that can lower our immune system.

Edited, to say one last thing. If you haven’t had the virus, continually practice all of the steps suggested to protect your ears, nose, and throat until the all clear is given.

bcredliner · #5 05-22-2020, 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crystalworks

Nobody wants the reminder. I certainly don't want there to be pandemics. It's more a reminder on a personal level of how really small and not in control of everything we all are (including our self-important government). How quickly things can change. I've spent more time with my parents and enjoyed watching them with my kids more now than ever before. It's nice to get the reminder that life is finite and to enjoy those you love for as long as you can. They seem to appreciate it more as well.

I don't think things will change on a national level, except maybe going to war with China (or someone else) once more information is gathered about its origination. But I hope I'm wrong on both counts.

No, I was referring to the media and certain politicians. They love to report on the most sensational, least rational, and greatest money generating points of view they can find.

Valid point. There are definitely differences between the seasonal flu and cov19. But there are similarities as well. The quote below from health.com shows how many people die (estimated) of flu each year according to the CDC and there is a range associated with the numbers as well, they are giving the estmate, while the CDC's website shows the whole range.

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/past-seasons.html

I definitely think the number for cov-19 will be higher than the seasonal flu, for reasons you mentioned (no vaccine, treatments). But it is not going to be catastrophic. As Andrew pointed out, it disproportionately affects the elderly just like the flu. Especially those with pre-existing conditions. If there has to be a silver lining, it looks like cov-19 might be less deadly to children than the flu.

All valid points. We are still learning about this. But don't let the "permanent damage" fear take hold yet. It could be true, we don't know. It's only been a few months. And it might only be in like .05% of cases if there is permanent damage... or it could be in 10% of cases. We don't know.

But as someone who has had walking pneumonia for a year without knowing (I have really large lungs and it took that long to progress and fill up with fluid enough to affect my breathing) and developed scar tissue in my lungs. With therapy and exercise, it does heal. My last set of films showed my lungs nice and clear again and I no longer wheeze on deep breaths. Smokers are also able to clear their lungs from years of damage after they quit. My sister was a lifelong smoker and would hack and gag all the time. She quit about a year ago, sounds like a totally different person.

^Now that above paragraph is unrelated to cov-19 per se, but the human body can repair itself to an amazing degree.

Sorry to post your whole message. How do I do those blue boxes? Never have learned how to do that.

Yes, I've been reflecting quite a lot. My wife and I are in MO. for who know how long so we are also a long way from our children who live in Dallas and our furry friends. We use Zoom and Facetime. We have been doing that since the shelter in place started so it's not much help anymore.

I agree they don't know enough about any permanent damage. Just wanted to bring that up as something to consider if one is not following the guidelines in their area. I certainly don't want to make it sound like the sky is falling because of this pandemic because I agree that it is not.

Virus cases are very low here in St. Joseph but it seems many more people are being careful than in Dallas. Dallas cases are starting to decline which means so far the staged opening and the number of people that aren't following the guidelines has had no perceivable impact toward increasing new cases. Same is true of all of Texas if you run a trend line to average out the spikes. It would be better without the spikes but it could be that is a reporting lag some days.

crystalworks · #6 05-22-2020, 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bcredliner

Sorry to post your whole message. How do I do those blue boxes? Never have learned how to do that.

Yes, I've been reflecting quite a lot. My wife and I are in MO. for who know how long so we are also a long way from our children who live in Dallas and our furry friends. We use Zoom and Facetime. We have been doing that since the shelter in place started so it's not much help anymore.

I agree they don't know enough about any permanent damage. Just wanted to bring that up as something to consider if one is not following the guidelines in their area. I certainly don't want to make it sound like the sky is falling because of this pandemic because I agree that it is not.

Virus cases are very low here in St. Joseph but it seems many more people are being careful than in Dallas. Dallas cases are starting to decline which means so far the staged opening and the number of people that aren't following the guidelines has had no perceivable impact toward increasing new cases. Same is true of all of Texas if you run a trend line to average out the spikes. It would be better without the spikes but it could be that is a reporting lag some days.

Yeah, this site does not make multi quoting easy. Takes me awhile as I usually open up people's quotes in multiple tabs and copy/paste from those into my main editing tab. It's tedious, but my OCD makes me do it. You can also use generic quote boxes using the button above the text window. It won't say who said what, but will add the blue box.

Hopefully, the trend down continues and you guys will feel safe returning to your home in Dallas at whatever time your ready. Fingers crossed cov19 peeters out so it can be sooner than later.

Quote:

Originally Posted by andrewwynn

@eod. Maybe you’re wrong look at all the cave drawings maybe they have SUV also.

SAV Andrew... SAV.

bcredliner · #7 05-22-2020, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crystalworks

Yeah, this site does not make multi quoting easy. Takes me awhile as I usually open up people's quotes in multiple tabs and copy/paste from those into my main editing tab. It's tedious, but my OCD makes me do it. You can also use generic quote boxes using the button above the text window. It won't say who said what, but will add the blue box.

Hopefully, the trend down continues and you guys will feel safe returning to your home in Dallas at whatever time your ready. Fingers crossed cov19 peeters out so it can be sooner than later.

SAV Andrew... SAV.

We aren't staying away from Dallas because of CD. Wife's father has about 2 months or less to live. We are very likely staying for the duration.

Happy · #8 05-22-2020, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bcredliner

We aren't staying away from Dallas because of CD. Wife's father has about 2 months or less to live. We are very likely staying for the duration.

I pray peace be upon your family, and with your wife especially.

Happy · #9 05-22-2020, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bcredliner

My wife and I are in MO.

I am trying to put together a plan to take a little break. I have a property in Branson, and I am hoping I can get away for a bit.

A vacation sounds so good right now. I am a bit frazzled.