Wearing a mask is not what people are upset about. If they could open businesses tomorrow but have to wear masks, they gladly would.

As the far left or far right is apt to do, you are trying to apply a single method of attack to a 350 million person population, spread across vast distances, with varying population densities, methods of transportation, with vastly different experiences of this pandemic. Some states haven't hit triple digit deaths yet.

Let me ask this, how long do you think a shelter in place order would take to guarantee the virus would not come back? I think it would take until you could test every adult in the population.

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A joint strategy doesn't mean every state uses the exact same strategy for infection prevention. I'm sure it'll be revised according to each state's particular needs due to their own unique geographic, demographic, and other variables and considerations.

But there should be some basic rules that will apply across the board, for instance the requirement to wear masks when in public, making Purell or equivalent available for all meetings or at access points and keeping 6 ft apart, etc, especially when the interaction is across statelines.

I'm certainly no expert but I have been waiting thus far without joy to see some concrete and thoughtful plan to open the economy from the federal level .

As for the exact duration for implementing the stay at home order, this is certainly not an easy question to answer.

Stay home too long and you won't have an economy to go back to, stay too short and you risk expanding an ever increasing infected population.

"Hammer and dance", is probably a good approach. You "tiptoe", or open the economy in a limited fashion while maintaining all prevention measures available, and see what happens. If the infection rate goes up, you bring down the hammer (the stay home mandate).

It's not going to be a smooth transition. There's going to be a lot of start and stop. But it might just be the new norm that brings us control over our lives and over this nasty virus.

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I don't think most of us care about political positions. Most of the opinions have been about whether or not one intends to follow the guidelines provided by experts or take another course of action based on either their version of a good plan and/or for some their particular circumstances.

None of the medical experts that I know of have taken a definitive position on how long it would take, too many variables. I have heard one say only that it should be significantly better in July or August but that depends on how well citizens follow the guidelines to prevent infection. That included how much testing and tracing is possible and did include carefully staged openings of the economy in some areas in May and others out to June or July.

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FIFY

What I said was that if your mask, gloves and decontamination regiment is good enough to keep you safe while you interact with people at "approved" places, then why would you get butthurt about there being MORE places open to do business where you can continue to take the same precautions?



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Love how you only quote portions u think would help ur case.

I guess when u don’t like somebody it just doesn’t matter whether what they have to say is right or not.

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Re-read your post again just now, so i don't wrongly equal you with those who wears no mask in demonstrating for a no holds barred return to work place.

I believe in "Hammer and Dance", a strategy which I've explained in detail twice on previous posts, so if you still choose to put me in the stay home at all costs camp...

You be wrong!

I like crystalworks. He works to find common ground between people.

You just have a lot of misdirected and pent-up anger and you like to place blames and build conflicts.

But you do not find common grounds.

Sarcasm on serious issues get tiresome really quick.

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"When the Team Chief said.... You're trapped in a hole with nothing but a goat and a slinky, what do you do? Stubby said, I'm not sure but it won't end well for the goat...." ~(Overheard) Last day, Phase 3, Q Course

It took a lot of death and wasted time for us to realize what we need to do. And in the process the US has become the new epicenter of the pandemic.

I'm just saying, let's be better prepared this time before opening the economy back up.

Don't just recommend, penalize those who don't wear masks or maintain social distance.

It takes just one person who goes unprotected to spread it around his social / business circle.

The fear of this virus might be ingrained on most people's minds, but there's still a lot of "brave folks" who choose to do whatever they please without regard for others.

On another note, California seems to have peaked at 2,283 cases on April 20th. It was 1,913 yesterday.

Hopefully it's now on a downward trend, but we won't know for certain unless we see a steady decline over the next couple of weeks.

Without an effective vaccine, our daily lives may never return to the pre covid19 norm.

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That's another issue, as mentioned. But is a political one. We have sheltered in place for 6 weeks which is what the medical experts have recommended.

I agree, and I think the past 6 weeks have given us time for that prep. San Antonio has issued citations for such violations. Mostly to businesses. But the mayor has said a few citations have been issued to private citizens as well. If the leaders of certain localities don't do their jobs, they should not be re-elected. I know Wal-Marts (or any grocery store) here won't even let you in the store without a face covering, I was just there today for the first time in over a month and could not believe the difference a month makes. EVERYONE had a mask and many had gloves.

Again, the car analogy applies. There will be certain members of the population who refuse to take any precautions. Think seat belts. Some people refuse to wear them. No amount of punitive action is going to change that. Focusing on those few individuals will not produce any policy that will change their behavior. Unless you are talking about killing them. But I doubt that.

I hope you are right and that you guys are at least flat lining. California is a huge state and I'd bet certain areas are going to do better than others. Texas' rural areas are barely feeling any effects at all, except for the economic ones.

Then you are only looking at it from one perspective. That of what is best, in a perfect world, from the guidance of the health care experts. If that were the case, I would agree with you wholeheartedly. We should all stay at home and live off our wealth. Government wouldn't have to hemorrhage money, under capitalized businesses both big and small would fail, and we could wait this thing out. We don't exist in that perfect world and many other factors have to be considered beyond what would save the most lives. I only mentioned the study because no matter the number, there is a correlation, between unemployment and added deaths. It was supporting my point (again no matter what number, unless your position is you doubt its validity at all and that there is no correlation) that we are trading one method of mortality for another. I was discussing honestly/earnestly enough to admit that the numbers of that study 37,000 have been looked at since then in other examinations who say the number is between 1500 and 37,000. I didn't use it as a "gotcha." I do remember it from "The Big Short" though I don't remember that line in Michael Lewis' book. Which is why I looked it up to see if I was passing bad information.

I have also heard all of that, and agree with them. But those are not the only issues as mentioned above. If you aren't able to place yourself in the position of others and, at least entertain, that the cure might be worse than the infection we have a different problem all together. Which is becoming pervasive in this country on both sides of the aisle. A lack of empathy and reason.

Ugh, that was flirting dangerously close to quoting Trump. But unlike many, I can admit when the other side might have the right idea. We have gone through pandemics before, but this is the first time a full lockdown has been utilized. We won't know what the 100% best course of action would have been, could have been, or should have been for many years. Which is why I emphasize might above.

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